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Automotive News & Views United Automobile Workers of America (UAW)
16738 messages, Last post on Dec 03, 2009 at 10:07 AM
You are in the Automotive News & Views Forum. Your Hosts are steve_ & claires
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Replying to: gagrice (Jan 01, 2009 8:48 pm) Q: What kind of impact has the meltdown had on company pension plans? A: It's hit them hard. Since most companies invest about 60 percent of their pension plans in stocks and about 40 percent in fixed-income assets such as bonds or money market accounts, they've lost significant money. Adrian Hartshorn, an actuary with business consultant Mercer, a division of Marsh & McLennan Companies Inc. (NYSE:MMC) , has been tracking the pension accounts of companies in the S&P 1500. At the end of 2007 the companies collectively had a surplus in their accounts of $60 billion. As of the end of September, the combined value had fallen to a deficit of $35 billion because of stock market losses. Without a recovery in the stock market, he said, that deficit could balloon into the hundreds of billions. http://bulletin.aarp.org/yourmoney/retirement/articles/meltdown__markets_effect_- on_retirement_plans.html |
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Replying to: dallasdude1 (Jan 02, 2009 7:16 am) Life's a gamble. If we have a depression the retirees will be doing better on their fixed income. Lets not forget that Nixon instituted the ill fated wage and price controls. You are trying to side step the issues again. Carter also imposed price controls and wage controls. And the interest rates went through the ceiling under his mismanagement of the Government. The year we got rid of Carter inflation was at 13.5% and we had horrible Unemployment. How many UAW workers lost their jobs during the four year reign of Carter? Its just foolish to think that Carter had any inflationary policies. I can tell you the rich got a lot richer during the Carter Presidency. T-Bills were paying 17% interest. That means someone invested in government bills they could make a lot more money than they could building cars. Business suffered immensely during that period. I know I went broke trying to run a farm. I guess you and I will just have to disagree on which side of the aisle has neutered the working class. As someone that worked my way up from minimum wage to a good wage, I consider business more important to a thriving economy than more government. The bigger the government has gotten the more working classes with the UAW included have fallen behind. When they say redistribution of wealth, better hang onto you wallet. They are looking at the middle class to pay the bills.
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Replying to: dallasdude1 (Jan 02, 2009 7:48 am) You do realize that only means that they lowered the wage scale. So that a new hire comes in at a lower rate than prior. You have consistently supported lower wages here on this forum. I have asked this before and no one seems to respond. How many years before that person coming in will reach the same wage as the person currently on top? Two tier means two different wage scales in my thinking. Besides it was a statement made by Whitey Hall long time UAW activist being interviewed by UAW retiree Mike Westfall. Mike, most people don’t know that our UAW International Reps live in a world apart from us. You have no clue as to what the UAW international rep is up against and what their demanding job entails. I was assuming the person that made the statement was in the know more than you are. Again it was part of an interview with UAW activists. http://www.intellectualconservative.com/2007/08/11/interview-with-whitey-hale/ You should read it. Gives you some real knowledge on the UAW's treatment of retirees. |
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Replying to: tlong (Jan 02, 2009 12:50 am) Perhaps your right. The legacy is the biggest issue. Its no secret that if the stock market is down, pension plans are underfunded. If the stock market is up, pension plans are over funded. So right now is not a good time and or an unattractive time to sell off. I've seen it many times. A company and or parts of the company are sold off. Then if the pension plan is over funded the new owners are legally allow to raid the pension plan. Usually its many pensions plans within a company. When they sell off parts of a company they split/spin off these pension plans. I've even seen a company purchased at a fire sale for millions, the pension plan raided for millions, and then the company sold for billions later on (a year or two). There are well funded folks out there that look for this very situation. They even financed the portions of the company they didn't want to a third party. They also honored the UAW contract and the new buyer, UAW and all, (successor clause) are doing beyond well. However, since the market is not doing well and if anything the owner would have to fund as oppose to raid the pension fund, its not going to happen. More than likely is that the pension plan would be dumped off on the taxpayers/PBGC in the end. So its a pick your poison situation. |
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Replying to: gagrice (Jan 02, 2009 6:02 am) I'm good, thanks for asking. Did your wife not have less risky options in her 401K? Don't tell me you were blinded by greed? Three of those years were 40% plus and none was a loss, since I bailed early last year. fidelity select energy services/fidelity select energy/fedility select natural resources/fedilety select natural gas/fedelity select chemicals were my core holdings. google/hansen/snapple were kind in the longer time frame too |
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Replying to: gagrice (Jan 02, 2009 7:58 am) In response to the spiraling inflation of the early 1970s, Richard Nixon became the first president to use price and wage controls during peacetime. The strategy did help to stabilize the economy but proved to be only a temporary fix. Unfortunately, Nixon's attempt to subdue inflation and reduce unemployment resulted in limited goods for consumers and increased business bankruptcies, while doing little to curb joblessness. By the time Nixon resigned in 1974, inflation had reached double digits and the American economy was mired in a deep recession. When inflation reached eighteen percent in 1980, Americans clamored for mandatory price and wage controls. President Jimmy Carter steadfastly refused, stating that peacetime controls during the 1970s had proven a dismal failure. http://www.answers.com/topic/price-and-wage-controls |
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The political season ended last November and we're still in the honeymoon period. Let's quit rehashing the 60's, 70's.... Y'all are making me feel my age.
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Replying to: gagrice (Jan 02, 2009 7:58 am) You fail to see that inflation is factored into that interest rate and that the purchasing power of that money decreases during inflationary periods. So if I buy a home for $100,000 and sell it for $200,000 in time. Then go to replace it and its selling for $200,000, I have gained nothing. |
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Replying to: steve_ (Jan 02, 2009 8:52 am)
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Replying to: dallasdude1 (Jan 02, 2009 9:00 am)  Meanwhile, the union needs to figure out their tax bill on the golf course. Is the UAW’s Black Lake in the red? (laborpains.org) |
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