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Automotive News & Views United Automobile Workers of America (UAW)
16705 messages, Last post on Nov 25, 2009 at 6:56 PM
You are in the Automotive News & Views Forum. Your Hosts are steve_ & claires
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Replying to: dallasdude1 (Dec 22, 2008 9:03 am) We could ramble all day about totally irrelevant issues to the collapse of the Big 3 and what part the UAW is playing in that collapse. Why is Gramm's wife so important and Dingell's wife with her high paid do nothing job at GM never mentioned? Could it be you have been so biased against the GOP that you believe the Dems are above reproach? You have pointed out all the assets the GM has sold over the last few years. Yet they still had $72 billion in losses over the same 4 years. Must be doing something wrong. Selling controlling interest in GMAC may have been real dumb now that no one wants to carry a lease on GM vehicles. Could it be that GM is paying for their ignorance in buckling under to the thug tactics of the UAW over the last 10 years? You do not make a good case for the UAW holding onto the status quo.
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Replying to: steve_ (Dec 22, 2008 8:18 am) An avg. Civic sells for $20k so 320/20000= 1.5% of total car value for cost of assembly wages paid to workers. Now I realize that FICA taxes are paid and so are benefits and eventually there could be even bonuses. The 10% UAW piece of an American car has to be a high estimate and include the legacy costs and the engine production and trans production labor that is UAW as well, since there is not even a 2:1 base wage ratio. It is easy to see how Honda derives more than half of it's worldwide profits from North America sales. |
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Replying to: dallasdude1 (Dec 22, 2008 9:03 am) Admission is the first step to recovery. Its economics 101 that the autos and housing are the first to go into recession and the first to recover. The process has been delayed by silly gimmicks, Zero down, employee pricing, red tag sale, to name a few. These do nothing but prolong the inevitable. Those who get in on these deals/gimmicks/promotions more than likely have a used car which is likely to be traded in. Hence, we glut the used car market (remember once you drive that new off the lot, its used). To reduce inventory deals/gimmicks/promotions/rebates are used to entice buyers. $5 dollar subs at Subway aren't going to make them much profit, however, they are only intended to weather the down cycle/keep the doors open for the better days to come. The car business is not any different. Frankly, I have no idea what you're talking about or how it applies to what I've said. It's a nice At this link, you'll find the bottom line for GM http://money.cnn.com/POLLSERVER/results/44132.html
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Replying to: lokki (Dec 22, 2008 10:58 am) |
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Replying to: gagrice (Dec 22, 2008 12:16 pm) 78% of those polled by the very liberal CNN would not buy a GM or Chrysler product after the bailout was announced. Not quite what it said. Are you more likely to buy a car from GM or Chrysler after Friday's bailout? So if you are the 35% or so who already may buy a GM of Chrysler product they are not more likely to buy. If you are the 65% who would not be buying a GM of Chrysler you are not more likely to buy a car from them. If what you said was true there would be only 22% or less buying that would be a huge drop in sales and that is not being shown in Decembers sales at least. Me personally and some of my friends are not more likely to buy a GM product because of the loans. So we would have been one of the 78%. The guy that always buys Ford/Toyota/whatever would also have been one of the 78%. And that 22% would now be MORE likely to buy their products. So the bailout is causing more to buy the vehicles. Perhaps because they feel the companies will be around or because they want to keep the companies in business or whatever.
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Replying to: dave8697 (Dec 20, 2008 11:10 am) ooooohhh...here comes the mr. humanity in all his glory. The savior of the species that is going to be extinct. Mr. Dave. This is called the Darwin's Theory. And I do not like the idea that everybody in the soccer match gets a trophy regardless of whether they won or lost, and even Kindergarten kids get a graduation certificate. Guess what? Do you know the US Tennis open player that came in 4th? or that football team that came in 4th place? >High school kid runs a 4:08 mile and comes in 4th place at a high school meet. His parents run over and congratulate him. Ah....I would not run over and congratulate him. Why should I? I would go over and offer my condolences and give him a spanking and a lecture so that he can try harder next time. Congratulate for coming in 4th? My foot. |
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Replying to: dave8697 (Dec 20, 2008 11:53 am) Are you somehow indicating that the poor quality of Automobiles is responsible for a better American life? and that improving the quality would somehow not improve the quality of life here?
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Replying to: dave8697 (Dec 21, 2008 7:34 am) True. higher wages are not what is making these cars unaffordable. It is the quality of car delivered at that price which is not realistic. Time and again, you are missing the point. The reason for an UAW wage cut is to make them realize that they are not worth their pay. They have to bring up their standards of workmanship if they want that pay. |
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Replying to: dallasdude1 (Dec 22, 2008 12:37 am) I'm glad to see that you agree with me that all bailouts are economically corrosive - no matter who benefits from them. We can't end them but that shouldn't stop us from arguing against them whenever we can. We classical liberals should take every opportunity to champion the core ideals of limited government, low taxes & maximum individual liberty. |
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Replying to: steve_ (Dec 22, 2008 8:18 am) Then too a supplier has labor cost too. This hard to factor in. The engine block is more than likely cast, placed in a holding fixture, machined in a CNC machine (computer numerical control). I've been to the machine tool manufacturers and Japanese are slow, we have $500,000 machines running on Windows 95. However, that plant was a 24 hour operation with one person on site for this late night operation. Since we do low rate production we have made changes which allow fast, I mean fast turn around. Some the parts we have made and shown them are beyond their scope. They go to the tool show and make a Alpha Romero motor and a few push rods fast to impress. However, we are doing things light years beyond their scope. In any case, I was told that the folks in Iraq were commenting that those Americans sure have lots of cruise missiles. |
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