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Automotive News & Views United Automobile Workers of America (UAW)
16738 messages, Last post on Dec 03, 2009 at 10:07 AM
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Replying to: gagrice (Dec 11, 2008 4:59 pm) I wonder, if we let them go bankrupt, is it just the tip of an even BIGGER iceberg than what we are talking about??? |
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Replying to: marsha7 (Dec 11, 2008 12:15 pm) The main purpose of a "Chapter 11" bankruptcy is to relieve a debtor of debts, thereby providing an opportunity for a fresh start. This is different from a "Chapter 7"bankruptcy, which involves the company shutting down its operations and the company's assetsbeing sold off. In each of the following questions, when the term "bankruptcy" is used, we are referring to a Chapter 11 bankruptcy. A Chapter 11 bankruptcy could also include selling off some or all of the Company's assets. It does allow temporary relief in all areas in the hopes of restoring normal business conditions. Besides, every creditor can and will kick in their legal/accounting fees to the total. Items such as wages, salaries, and sick leave are considered as normal administrativeexpenses while in bankruptcy. The bankruptcy laws assure that employees will continue to bepaid for their services during the reorganization. In addition, certain "pre-petition claims," for items like unpaid medical expenses and other benefits are given priority status in bankruptcy,meaning that they are paid before any other general unsecured claims. However, under the law,the maximum amount of such claims that can be give priority status is limited to $4,650 per employee. A company can ask for modification and or voiding of a labor contract. Section 1113 of the bankruptcy code lays out the rules an employer must follow if it decides to seek to reject labor contracts. It ensures that negotiations between a Chapter 11 employer and a union occur before the company asks the court to allow it to reject a collective bargaining agreement. It lays out the stringent standard by which a bankruptcy court must evaluate an application to reject an agreement, and it establishes a time frame in which the court may make its determination.A collective bargaining agreement remains in effect, and the collective bargaining process continues, after the filing of a bankruptcy petition "unless and until" the company complies with the provisions of Section 1113. Accordingly, before the court may authorize the rejection of acollective bargaining agreement the company must prove to the court that the following nine (9)requirements have been met: 1. The company must have made a proposal to the union. 2. The proposal must be based upon the most complete and reliable information available atthe time of the proposal. 3. The modifications must be necessary to permit reorganization. 4. The modifications must provide that all affected parties are treated fairly and equitably. 5. The company must provide the union with such relevant information as is necessary toevaluate the proposal. 6. The company must have met with the collective bargaining representative at reasonabletimes subsequent to making the proposal. 7. The debtor must have negotiated with the union concerning the proposal in good faith. 8. The union must have refused to accept the proposal without good cause.9. The balance of the equities must clearly favor rejection of the agreement.If the court agrees that the company has met these conditions, it may authorize the rejection ofthe Collective Bargaining Agreement.Overview of the 1113 Process An explanation of the sections of the bankruptcy code that allows temporarymodifications and permanent rejection of collective bargaining agreements is outlinedbelow.1113 (c) -Total RejectionSection 1113 (c), Chapter 11, of the U.S. Bankruptcy Code. Section 1113 (c) allows acompany to ask a judge to reject, terminate, labor contracts.Section 1113 (c) states:The court shall approve an application for rejection of a collective bargaining I agreementonly if the court finds that - (1) the trustee has, prior to the hearing, made a proposal that fulfills therequirements of subsection (b)(I); (2) the authorized representative of the employees has refused to accept suchproposal without good cause; and (3) the balance of the equities clearly favors rejection of such agreement.By law, a hearing on the 1113(c) petition is to be held within fourteen days from the dateof the filing of the application. However, the court may extend the time for the commencement of such hearing for a period not exceeding seven days.The court is required to rule on the application for rejection within thirty days after thedate of the commencement of the hearing. However, the court may extend the time formaking a ruling for an additional period as the company and the Union may agree to. Ifthe court does not rule on the application within thirty days after the date of thecommencement of the hearing, or within such additional time as the company and union may agree to, the company may terminate or alter any provisions of the collective bargaining agreement pending the ruling of the court.In 1113 (c) applications the judge has only two options when making a ruling; reject the company's application and leave the labor contract intact, or approve the application and terminate the labor agreement completely. The judge cannot impose permanent contract terms on the parties. Its a bit longer and deal with defined pensions, bargaining in good faith, if and when the agreement is there is a termination of a collective bargaining agreement. |
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Replying to: cooterbfd (Dec 11, 2008 5:17 pm) I wonder, if we let them go bankrupt, is it just the tip of an even BIGGER iceberg than what we are talking about??? Depends who you think is more correct. 3 think tank type groups or the Republicans down south with the competitors plants. Heck, even the competitors down south are scared of one of the big 2 going under. There is a rep (Mike Stanton, Association of International Automobile Manufacturers) for all the import brands and I saw him on a show and he said all the imports companies are very concerned and feel we cannot let any of the big 3 go under because it will take the suppliers out with them. But heck, he is in the industry too so he must be biased. http://www.autolinedetroit.tv/show/1242?play |
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Replying to: 62vetteefp (Dec 11, 2008 6:10 pm)
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Replying to: 62vetteefp (Dec 11, 2008 6:10 pm) You know the answer to that prediction. Regards, OW |
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Replying to: gagrice (Dec 11, 2008 4:59 pm) insured up to $100k. Credit Union paying 4.2% for the loan and getting 2.5%. Need to look around and see if I can do better on the market account. I was discussing a loan with a broker for a foreclosed house and he asked if my Home Equity loan was cancelled yet. Guess they are cancelling them left and right even if you have good equity. Lack of money to loan. The limit was lowered recently though.
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Replying to: cooterbfd (Dec 11, 2008 5:17 pm) That is the $64,000 question. Right now the country and the World is slowly bleeding. Where do you try to stop it? I never faced a layoff in 46 years working for several companies. All Union jobs and I was in on the start, except for Pacific Telephone. I cannot possibly know what it must feel like to face a layoff. With the collapse of the price of oil friends and family in Alaska are being hit. My son was a chef at one of the top restaurants and brewery companies in Wasilla Alaska. They went out of business the end of November. I think the building industry has been hurt the worst. I don't hear any talk of bailing out the builders that are going bankrupt. I can tell you one thing. If I was one of the last UAW workers still on the job the last 10 years. I would be saving every penny and downsizing my life. It did not take a degree in economics to see the loss of market share, especially at GM. When a million of my fellow UAW workers lost their jobs since the 1970s, I would be on a short spending leash. What were these workers thinking when their company was not making any decent return during the SUV boom? Over the last 35 years I was in on a lot of our negotiations. I did a lot of research to see what our company was making and learning their weaknesses. If they were top heavy with engineers and crying no money. I would point that out to them. A couple times they were legitimately hurting and our contracts reflected that downturn. We even took a cut in one contract. That was tough to sell. The UAW will play a big part in any turnaround at GM. I don't think Congress will give GM any money unless the UAW concedes at least to the competition level. There is no bringing the competition up. Too late for that to happen. We are talking weeks from bankruptcy. |
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Replying to: cooterbfd (Dec 11, 2008 2:58 pm) LTV tried to use law to lawfully dump their pension fund. The federal judge ruled, while legal other copy cats would do likewise, and ruled against them. All the while creditors legal and accounting fees amassed. Good plan, bad outcome. At one time or another they owned National car rental, Wilson sports, Braniff, resorts, and many others in the conglomerate period/era. Much like GE today.
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Replying to: 62vetteefp (Dec 11, 2008 6:15 pm) You can help both GM & yourself. |
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Replying to: dallasdude1 (Dec 11, 2008 5:13 pm) Back to topic. Things certainly aren't looking good. Guess I'm glad I've got two domestic cars in the driveway just in case displaced UAW and supplier workers decide to take their frustrations out on foreign metal. I grew up around the steel mills and I still remember watching TV as a kid around 1980 when it was common to see steel workers taking sledge hammers to Japanese cars. |
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