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Automotive News & Views United Automobile Workers of America (UAW)
16715 messages, Last post on Dec 01, 2009 at 7:43 PM
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Replying to: rockylee (Jan 27, 2008 5:27 pm) The difference is that Tiger Woods sells Buicks by endorsing them. Those in the jobs bank just raise the cost per vehicle. The jobs banks would have been less of a glaring problem if they were tied to getting re-trained. If you collect a pay check you are taking classes and getting a passing grade. This would have been a benefit to the employee. Enslaving them to a rubber room is not healthy for their minds. You cannot spin that entitlement into anything that is good. That was the dumbest thing the automakers allowed themselves to sign onto. Then comes health care for the life of the retiree. As far as GM paying them not to work or the government. Unemployment compensation is paid by the corporations. I think because you and some others are so close to the auto makers that foundations like the Harbour report mean something to you. I never heard of it until this thread was started. Each profession has publications that are specific to that field. They are of little interest to anyone else. And statistics put out by Harbour or CR or JD Powers are just data arranged to tell a story. I want to know what the total cost is per car. With all extraneous costs. Including the golden parachutes given to non productive management.
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Replying to: gagrice (Jan 27, 2008 6:14 pm) I thought the term was limited for the worker in jobs bank. I recall some articles about the jobs band in Kettering. Dayton is a suburb of Kettering along with Moraine where an IUE plant is located. Didn't the jobs bank occur because the auto companies had agreed not to reduce employment below a certain level at certain plants for a certain number of years when they agreed to some contracts. So they couldn't reduce workers at a particular plant under those constraints. Hence those unneeded workers didn't show up at the work line but they showed up at the jobs bank location. The article I recall described many as biding their time and a few feverishly making use of the resources, job hunts, college online classes, and I believe classes at the local (3) universities and junior college. |
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Replying to: rockylee (Jan 27, 2008 5:37 pm) I was in the 35% marginal federal income tax bracket while making less than today's minimum wage during Carter's last year in office. I bought a house in the year after Carter left office and 30 yr. fixed mortgage rates were 17.5% on my closing day. My rent was increasing 15% a year under Carter so I bought a house anyway. Reagan's effect on me: Iran was s*itting on our country and laughing about it hard in 1979, but they knew they had to free the hostages at about 9PM on election day in 1980 when the country dumped Carter. Within 2 years I was in the 15% marginal tax bracket and I'm still in it. Unions fought for and won important benefits for all workers. My family survived on union wages growing up, but if a Carpenter's Union worker didn't pull their weight they were physically attacked because if the union hall didn't perform, they didn't get the next job or jobs and men and their families went hungry. 24 years later, when I got to work amongst the UAW, I told my dad that the fast workers (new hires at reduced pay) were screamed and yelled and cussed at by the ones with 25-30 years in, threatening them to slow down to maybe 60% production rate or there would be big trouble. This was done in front of the management. Quite a contrast in attitudes. Go getters -vs- thugs. Today, all 31,000 GM jobs are gone from my county. Every last one. What company can afford to let a capable person put out 60% while demanding other co-workers do likewise, and while the Third world joins the global economy, willing to work for as little as 9 cents an hour, and is quickly becoming your competition?
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do you think I miss my wacky Boeing job with suck-ups around every corner? The SPEEA union mentality that "let's fight against Mr.Big Boeing man, even if we don't understand what we're fighting for"...let's just fight.I couldn't believe it, in 2000 we struck Boeing for better wages, better health care benefits, etc. It was the longest white collar strike in U.S. history...45 days long. The first offer from Boeing, that SPEEA members "fought off" and voted no on ended up being the better offer than the second Boeing offer that SPEEA "recommended" a yes vote on. The union thugs had everybody all so gung-ho to fight that they were blinded to the contracts details. We would have saved on health insurance and the pay part of it was just arranged differently, so that either offer would've worked out fine. But the benefits were worse on the second, agreed-to offer! I know for sure that they were, I studied the minutia in enlarged detail to make sure of this. They were blinded with union stupidity. Can I get a witness here? Marsha? Does this sound like you've heard this type of stuff before? After the strike ended they were all tromping around "we showed 'em, yeah, rah-rah-rah!" What a bunch of hyperactive dorks. Unions are a crock. No, Boeing can fall in to the Puget Sound and their managers can wrestle with some of the larger octopii down at the bottom for all I care. I've never worked at such a politically-charged, dopey, Seattle's Best and raspberry donut sparkled place in all my life. Trouble is, I spent nearly 20 years working towards retirement there and some stupid, short-sighted group of know-it-all suckups decides to outsource a whole group's work. Yeah, it's all about the money. Nobody is deemed permanently helpful to the money-grubbers and business suit dorks who "must know it all"...I mean, they're wearing these grey suits and wear their Boeing badges proudly. I was a union worker who worked hard and worked towards saving the company money, too. I didn't need some stupid continuous quality improvement Deming program to point me towards that. I just did it on my own because I knew it was right. And how did I get rewarded? Pink slip and a little nip of Boeing's fortune to go re-train in a real career. The Pacific NW can have and suckle Boeing to their hearts content. The big war against evil empire Airbus Industrie. Enjoy it, dorks and know-it-alls. The SPEEA union mentality was a joke and still is and really is as ineffectual an entitiy as could suck money off of members. rocklee...whoever can suck a good salary off of mad Boeing can have at it. That whole area is a soul-sucking angst-ridden cesspoool of grey, drizzly skies and dreary depression. I favor the hot and sunny Arizona desert and a chance to directly help people with their health. I feel like I can have some control over my career, not being ping-ponged around like at Boeing by know-nothings in grey suits who wouldn't know a smart, honest hard-working employee if it hit them over their thick skulls dead-on. My second pink slip was a real blessing to me and the SPEEA union remains just one more dopey factor in the Boeing game that leaves one with an insecure, shaky future and less money in your pocket at the same time. I am happy to be an Allied Healthcare, non-unionized employee in the land of Geronimo and General Crook and Fort Bowie. Gentlemen-draw your swords! 
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Replying to: dave8697 (Jan 27, 2008 6:26 pm) One of my best friends that I worked with for 37 years came to Alaska as an IBEW telephone installer. The first week on the job in our office he was told to slow down by the shop steward. He was terminating twice as many pairs of wires as the old timers. The IBEW in Alaska during the 1960s and 70s were known as feather bedders. One of our engineers on the installation caught wind of what was going on. He talked to my boss and we hired Bob to work directly for RCA as a Teamster. He is going to retire this year. At 63 he is still one of the fastest workers I have ever worked with. The IBEW lost several big contractors that went non-Union because of the old timers holding up jobs. So it does happen. |
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Replying to: iluvmysephia1 (Jan 27, 2008 9:01 pm) So the right to work laws have not hindered your making a living wage? I think more people with the, Union is the only way mentality, need to see that there are opportunities outside of Union jobs. |
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Replying to: marsha7 (Jan 27, 2008 4:43 pm) You got that right! I as I was born and raised here in Georgia, I remember how proud we were that a peanut farmer from south Georgia had become president. Didn't take long for that pride to turn into something quite the opposite. What an embarrassment he was, and still is. Before Carter was out of office the interest rates were ridiculous. Good news was that Bank Certificates of Deposit were paying 15%. Bad news was that Mortgages were 17%-19% and car loans were 19%-22%, for those with good credit. Not good for auto or housing. Unemployment was averaging around 10%. Not a healthy situation. I well remember the PATCO situation, as I was maintaining equipment for FAA at Hampton Ga, and at the local PATCO on Phoenix Blvd. in College park. On the surface, PATCO was wanting better working conditions for the controllers. That is what the news media were told and what they were reporting. In conversations during lunch, it became very apparent that money was also an issue. In fact money was THE issue. More than once I heard, that "THEY" were underpaid when compared to the Pilots. "Sick-outs" were running rampart, and it was a very dangerous situation with Planes flying around and not enough control or guidance from the ground. When Reagan took office, he gave them a time frame to get back to work so that the skys could be safer while negotiations took place. Some came back. Those that didn't were fired. He kept his word. He didn't bust the Union. They busted themselves. They were trying to hold the entire country, and the feds hostage, through the airline industry, and it backfired on them. To add insult to injury, PATCO started trying to help their "Fallen" soldiers by finding them jobs. Why was it an insult? Because PATCO was charging for that service. In effect they became an employment agency with a captive audience of the very people they had persuaded to "Hang" in there and the Government will fold!  Yes, I felt for those guys. Some had become friends. They were living a good life one day and facing hard times the next. They Believed their Union Leaders! A lot of them were re hired after a time frame. Of course we didn't hear much about that from the liberal Reagan hating press. Kip
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Replying to: tedebear (Jan 27, 2008 8:37 am) OK, Thanks. Recon we were reading that from 2 different views. I thought he was saying that if the 50 remaining workers could produce the same number of cars without the 50 that were lost, it would indicate that the LOST 50 were not needed in the first place, and causing an unnecessary drain on the company. Thanks, Kip |
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Replying to: rockylee (Jan 27, 2008 4:20 pm) As for Rush, he's probably called that because of all the drugs coursing through his system. The crackhead babbling underneath the elevated train probably makes as much sense as this so-called radio "personality."
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Replying to: kipk (Jan 28, 2008 3:54 am) He could have declared war on Iran and then shot them all for treason during war time.
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