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Vans & Minivans 2008 Minivans 
1261 messages, Last post on Feb 27, 2008 at 7:47 AM
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Consumer Reports has customer survey dots showing the best & worst problems. Chrysler's boxes show alot of black ones, where as Honda Odyssey & Toyota Sienna show mostly red ones. Don't mention Odyssey transmissions to me. I have a 2002 Odyssey with 175,000 kms on it. I also have NOT had any mechanical problems.  If you are thinking about buying a Chrysler product maybe you should wait a year so that any bugs in these new Chrysler minivans are worked out and have consumer reports show alot more red dots.
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Replying to: autowrite (Sep 06, 2007 9:56 pm) That could be a smart move, as these 2008 minivans are new from the ground up. Plus, Chrysler is coming out with a whole new line of V-6 engines in the next year or two.They also have some new innovations to their new six speed automatic transmission. The Phoenix engines were first discussed by "superduckie" way back in March 2006. “ask1919” wrote in April, “Phoenix will be a collection of V6 engines to replace the whole line.” oh20, whose track record has been 100% accurate on such breakthroughs as the Caliber and Sebring, wrote in July 2006 that the engines would include the following. (list updated May 2007). As of this last writing, all will have variable valve timing and some will even have multiple displacement, which is rare in a V6. Chrysler wrote that: “The new Phoenix of V-6 engines will feature cylinder deactivation (MDS). Specifically, this means the engine will operate efficiently on three cylinders when less power is needed, and in V-6 mode when more power is needed. This optimizes fuel economy when V-6 power is not required – without sacrificing vehicle performance or capability. “The new family of V-6 engines will feature an aluminum die cast block, dual variable valve timing (VVT) and a two-stage oil pump, among other technologies. The end result is an expected across-the-board V-6 fuel efficiency improvement of six to eight percent – in addition to new levels of V-6 power, performance and refinement.” It would seem Chrysler has no intention of letting up on Honda and Toyota in their minivan market.
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Replying to: marine2 (Sep 06, 2007 11:55 pm) The 4.0 V6 is based on the multivalve 3.5 V6 that's been around a few years. This same 4.0 V6/6 spd auto has been used in the 07 Pacifica for the past year without problem. I don't put much credit into CR's little black dots. I've compared them to my 05 DCX van and have yet to have any of their problems. I had a Chevy Cavalier that I put 180k very trouble free miles on, when CR said I should have bought a Honda or Toyota. Their recent comparison of the Chevy and Toyota pickup was so skewed to Toyota, so plainly biased....it was pathetic for CR!! Pick up any issue of CR and note what cars pics are always blastered their cover or lead page of articles....Japanese! Ohhh sure, they "balance" out the pics in the individual writeups but all additional pics are Jap, even if they do happen to approve a domestic model as a token gesture. |
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Replying to: ateixeira (Sep 05, 2007 11:25 am) Actually my ex is a chasis engineer for GM, he's now in Australia working for Holden. If you get him talking, he'll tell you there's plus and minuses for both suspensions, and it's not strictly a cost issue. A Toyota/Chrysler system with coils and torsion beam is preferred if you're towing anything....it tracks truer, provides better control. The Honda's wishbones will give a better overall ride but most people wouldn't notice it unless you live on a rutted road someplace. The same for pushrods. Many of the Jap engines show impressive figures on paper but for example Torque is generated much higher in RPM band. Sure, the 08 Dodge van is an improvement over the very outdated 07 vans (the 2nd row windows didn't even open). But we're not comparing those. Now there's a "ice cream topping"....2nd row windows tha open!! How many people you see driving around with windows opened anymore? I'd rather stow n go seats, or power rear hatch, or power folding seats, or knee airbags, or back up camera... Things you can get on any DCX van, in any combination, that you can't on any other minivan.
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Replying to: dennisctc (Sep 07, 2007 3:14 am) As for the rear suspension. I think as long as the ride is smooth and stable, who is going to care what kind of suspension it has? I mean no one seems to care that Chrysler has self leveling shocks on the their vans and Honda doesn't. |
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I think the below article says it all, and I quoted the final paragraphs. As a driver, I'll take the Odyssey, although all the kids in the back may like a Grand Caravan more. From the article: http://www.edmunds.com/insideline/do/Drives/Comparos/articleId=122398 "One Winner, but It's Close Dodge has built its best minivan ever in the new Grand Caravan. It's quick, comfortable, innovative. And with so many versions and so many options it's sure to deliver exactly what so many buyers are looking for. It's clearly...the second-best van on the market. The Honda Odyssey, however, is still the best of the breed, and the best for breeders. It's quiet, beautifully finished and well equipped. It also handles better than some sedans and is the only minivan that could be considered a driver's car. It's the one Dad can drive without feeling like Mom. And it's bound to get even better. For 2008 the Odyssey will receive a long list of revisions, including the adoption of Honda's second generation VCM cylinder cutoff system to improve fuel mileage. And the rest of minivandom continues to play catch-up."
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you can be the best one year and not the next. This year it's Chrysler's turn. Each of us will have a unique opinion, but I agree with Ward's and still think the Toyota 2GR V6 is the only minivan power mill among the 10 Best. More HP and more MPG. Nice to see Chrysler is working on MDS and VVT. dennis: not to dismiss your positive experience but you're comparing a sample of one vs. a sample of over 1000 (their minimum for each model to publish results) for Consumer Reports. I'll go with the 1000+, no offense. Torsion beams are compact and cheap, those are the 2 primary reasons they are used. These vans tow 3500 lbs, no more than Honda does. Check out the Toyota 2GR V6's torque curve, you don't think that's flat? Check out the low rpm torque. It's the one on the right.
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Replying to: bobw3 (Sep 07, 2007 9:34 am) LOLOLOL....just noticed "Breeders", there's only certain types of guys who use this term!!! |
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Replying to: dennisctc (Sep 07, 2007 3:14 am) Ice Cream Toppings are OPTIONS, folks. Things you get in the standard, base van are not ice cream toppings. Things like windows that open in the 2nd row come in the base van. They are not options. All models have them. I use them any time my kids are saying good bye to friends or family, so basically often. I don't even understand this last paragraph: I'd rather stow n go seats, or power rear hatch, or power folding seats, or knee airbags, or back up camera... Things you can get on any DCX van, in any combination, that you can't on any other minivan. Just about every van out there has a power rear hatch, you say "can't on any other"?! Huh? Same thing for backup cameras. All the vans I test drove had those. Can't on any? That doesn't make sense. Toyota had power folding seats way back in 2004. You need to get out more often. Have you even looked at a Sienna?  Chrysler deserves kudos for the Stow-n-Go, Swivel-n-Go, self-leveling rear suspension, and 6 speed auto. I'll give them kudos for the knee air bags if and only if their crash tests scores beat the competition, we'll have to wait and see on that one. |
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According to Consumer Reports' survey of owners, 79% of Sienna owners would buy the car again compared to 49% of Chrysler Town & Country owners. hansienna falls in the 21% of Sienna owners that will buy something else next time. He is in the minority, and he's very vocal for whatever reason. Ask 2 Dodge/Chrysler owners and on average 1 of those 2 will tell you the same thing. Bottom line is Sienna owners are happier on average. Hopefully the Dodge numbers will improve substantially with the arrival of the 2008 models. |
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