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Vans & Minivans 2008 Minivans 
1261 messages, Last post on Feb 27, 2008 at 7:47 AM
You are in the Vans & Minivans Forum. Your Host is Karens
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Replying to: marine2 (Sep 05, 2007 10:38 am) Plus I think some of the features on the T&C are gimmicky to me. Most minivan owners have carseats attached to the seats in the 2nd row, so they're never going to use the stow-n-go feature on the road like they do in the TV commercials. And with the turning seats...I really don't think that kids (let alone adults) are going to be sitting facing each other knocking knees while driving down the highway. Maybe these things look good on TV commercials, but in reality, the minivan crowd doesn't look like the folks on TV. They're really interested in hauling a few kids around in car seats and booster seats and with a bunch of stuff behind the 3rd row on family vacations. Or with the autofolding 3rd row...give me a break. It's faster just to flip down the spit 3rd row of a Sienna or Odyssey then to wait for the autofold feature to work. But then I feel the same way with the auto-sliding doors, but then they have at least some practical benefit.
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Replying to: marine2 (Sep 05, 2007 10:38 am) Take that back, it was a 30,000 mile check up, not 15,000. |
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Replying to: bobw3 (Sep 05, 2007 10:56 am) Right and for the little ones, Chrysler is the only minivan to offer intergrated child booster seats built right into one of their models. Like I said, they offer everything to everybody except eight passinger seating. |
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Replying to: marine2 (Sep 05, 2007 10:22 am) Very outdated info. That engine was the 3.0l that was replaced. Even that engine's successor was replaced. You're complaining about an engine from two generations ago! That's just it, though, you see Toyota coming out with new engines, each more powerful and more efficient than the last. Let's not forget those Honda transmissions that people were replacing 2 or 3 times Got me there, but my neighbor had the same issue with 3 Dodge vans. If it was the wrong fluid then Dodge dealers have to be re-trained. For the 4th time. We have to wait and see about the longevity of this 6 speed. Blaming Dodge owners for using the wrong ATF type yet giving Toyota owners a pass for not changing their oil shows a blatant double-standard, IMO. Plus Toyota vans now have a maintenance minder oil change light on the dash, so it's unlikely to happen again. What has Dodge done that actively prevents owners from using the wrong type of ATF again? I'd like to see measured road noise to see if the new Caravan is quieter than the Sienna, but to be honest I doubt it. The air bags you mention has been standard on the Sienna for a while now, Honda too. Toyota made VSC standard for 08, though most models had it before. Honda made VSA standard years ago, and yes VSA incorporates both stability and traction control. Coil springs? Am I supposed to be impressed by that? You must be kidding. You drank the kool aid. The rear suspension is not fully independent. Honda wins there, period. No argument there. Toyota still uses a torsion beam as well, so both are well behind Honda in this regard. How can you even try to spin the suspension as an advantage over the Honda? Give us a break. Sure, the 08 Dodge van is an improvement over the very outdated 07 vans (the 2nd row windows didn't even open). But we're not comparing those.
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Replying to: ateixeira (Sep 05, 2007 11:25 am) I didn't say Chrysler had a better rear suspension than Toyota. But it's much better than they had, and the front suspension has the only adjustable shocks on a minivan. The second row windows roll down now and have built in screens that lower into the body. This minivan is hands over heals over what they had. And on a wole, as good or better than the competition. Got to go pick up my grand daughter from school.
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Replying to: marine2 (Sep 05, 2007 11:40 am) I'm not convinced it's the best, though. That requires a no-excuses effort. The price on the Edmunds tester of more than $39k is also in the no-excuses level. I would have liked to see them offer a multi-valve engine (which was considered during the last refresh, but shelved) at that price. If they did, maybe they wouldn't have to offer rebates once the newness fades. I'm sure they have contracts with current engine suppliers to keep certain plants operating, and that's why the 3.3l and 3.8l engines carry on, but c'mon, it's not 1997 any more, Chrysler. Time for a clean sheet. |
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Replying to: ateixeira (Sep 05, 2007 11:59 am) Let me repeat what I said before, because it's obvious, you didn't understand me. "It's been hard for Chrysler and Ameerican automotive manufactures to compete with the advantages the foreign makers have in profit. They can't put as much in R/D into their vehicles. Foreign makers here are not paying the health care for retirees. Have thousands fewer retirees to pay for. Not paying as much in health care, because their employees are younger. Got many of their new plants at big tax discounts to bring them into these states. Pay lower wages." Japanese widen profit gap over U.S. automakers Associated Press August 8, 2007 Article tools E-mail Share Digg Del.icio.us Facebook Furl Google Newsvine Reddit Spurl Yahoo Print Single page view Reprints Reader feedback Text size: TRAVERSE CITY, Mich. - Japanese automakers widened their profit-making gap over the Big Three domestic automakers last year by 31 percent, according to a study released Tuesday. The profit gap, which already was significant in 2005 at $2,899 per vehicle sold in North America, widened by $915, to $3,814, according to a study of industry costs and profits by Laurie Harbour-Felax, managing director of Stout Risius Ross, a Chicago-based financial and operational advisory firm. The study, made public at an automotive industry conference, found that while General Motors Corp. had improved its efficiency and cut production costs, the nation's largest automaker and its Detroit counterparts, Ford Motor Co. and Chrysler LLC, still have a long way to go to match the profits of Toyota Motor Corp., Honda Motor Co. and Nissan Motor Co. GM cut its loss per vehicle in North America to $146 in 2006 from $1,271 in 2005, largely because of cost cuts that included the departure of more than 34,000 hourly workers to buyout and early retirement offers. It also is saving money on efforts to design cars and trucks globally, by increasing the number of parts common to all of its vehicles and by purchasing parts on a global basis, Harbour-Felax said. "GM has done the most from this as you look at their whole product lineup," she said. Still, GM made $2,123 less per vehicle than Toyota in 2006, according to the report. Toyota, the most profitable of all automakers on a per-vehicle basis, increased its profit per vehicle from $1,175 in 2005 to $1,977 in 2006, the report said. The numbers for individual manufacturers are at times lower than the overall gap because they do not include special write-offs, Harbour-Felax said. Ford, while it has made progress on cost cuts, common parts and globalization, still had a $3,939 profit gap in 2006 when compared with Toyota, Harbour-Felax said. Chrysler's profit gap with Toyota averaged $3,088 per vehicle for 2006 mainly because it was "force feeding" the market by selling vehicles with heavy incentives, she said. The labor cost difference between the Big Three and the Japanese automakers amounts to $1,200 to $1,500 per vehicle, Harbour-Felax said. Although the domestic automakers likely are to seek parity with the Japanese in ongoing contract talks with the United Auto Workers, that won't solve all of their problems because labor costs make up only about 10 percent of the cost of a vehicle, she said. The average price of a vehicle in the U.S. last year was $28,451, according to the National Automobile Dealers Association.
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Replying to: ateixeira (Sep 05, 2007 11:59 am) Now the 3.8 might be an old design, but it's been dependable and there isn't that much difference in acceleration than Honda's new engine and five speed tranny. Less than two sec. with Chrysler's four speed tranny in the quarter mile. That could be even less with Chrysler's new six speed tranny. I hear Chrysler's new 4.0 is at least a second faster than the Honda. As if it makes much of a difference either way. Of course the Honda people made it a big difference about it before. I am sure they will think it irrelevant now that the 4.0 is faster. I don't know, Chrysler's new 4.0 may not be the old push rod engine. But if it's as dependable aas the 3.8, I wouldn't complain. I don't think all of Toyota's problem was just oil. Wasn't it determined the passageways were to small in that engine, not allowing the oil to flow freely, there by gathering up into sludge? |
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Replying to: davethewave1 (Sep 05, 2007 4:31 am)
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Replying to: dennisctc (Sep 05, 2007 1:30 pm) Now I also have an '07 Sienna. I'm very happy with. It cost a bit more, but for me it was worth it. At the time I got it (July), the new T&C's were not out. If they were I would have looked at them, although my suspicion is that I would have still ended up with the Sienna. It seems a lot of new ideas come from DCX, and many are copied by others. The innovations in the new T&C's are interesting, but I do have a couple of concerns about the Swivel 'n Go. First, for me riding backwards in a vehicle makes me incredibly nauseous; many years ago I had to ride a school bus with backwards-facing seats for a couple of years  Second, I'd be a little leery of having a hard table in front of the 3rd seat in the event of an accident; perhaps the seatbelt would keep my kids from hitting the table, but it would still make me nervous. I think with crash testing they don't seem to check what happens to the back seat passengers; I would want some reassurance that the table would not be a problem.
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