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Vans & Minivans 2008 Minivans 
1261 messages, Last post on Feb 27, 2008 at 7:47 AM
You are in the Vans & Minivans Forum. Your Host is Karens
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Replying to: marine2 (Feb 23, 2008 10:53 pm) The automotive business is truly international in scope. Ford and GM both have substantial markets and manufacturing sourced internationally; Toyota, Honda, BMW, Daimler, Subaru, Nissan et al have parts and manufacturing sources as well as development and engineering within the US. A company's profits are accrued to the share holders and alongside Ford and GM you can trade Honda, Toyota, Nissan, Daimler etc on the NYSE; and if you invest in Asia/Pacific mutual or index funds, you own some of the Japanese/Korean companies and likewise European companies in those mutual and index funds. A decision on which vehicle to buy should be made with the right goals in mind and those goals should purely relate to how the vehicle will be used, the costs entailed and the value returned. All nationalism does is muddy the water and lead people to choose a vehicle that costs too much or does not fit their needs. If American manufacturers can build competitive quality vehicles at competitive prices then they will survive in the marketplace. By subsidizing non-competitive industries all we do is make ourselves poorer while delaying the inevitable. Unfortunately for Chrysler, one con that must be weighted into the purchase of their minivan is the possibility that Cerebrus decides to cut their losses and pull the plug. Of the big three, Chrysler is in the weakest position during a domestic economic slump having been divested in the 1970s of the brands that gave it any significant international presence. What is a lifetime warranty worth when the company no longer exists? The T&C and GC are nice vans, but are they enough nicer and enough less expensive to overcome these hurdles? That is one of the questions I am exploring. A similar questioning should come when looking at any vehicle from the Big3. GM is in the strongest position, but they are all bleeding cash. Buying a Toyota, Honda or Nissan I would be confident that the manufacturer will be around to support the vehicle for a long time to come.
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Replying to: yatesjo (Feb 26, 2008 11:14 pm) This is like comparing a fly to an elephant. The engineering and development presence of all these OEMs is TINY.....support engineering in the plant, some artistic design studios maybe in CA, and an "engineering" office here is detroit. No one is saying to pay too much for a domestic minivan, or buy an inferior product. That's hardly the case when choosing a Chrysler minivan where you got new technologies/features, equal or better quality, better warranty and lower prices. The T&C and GC are nice vans, but are they enough nicer and enough less expensive to overcome these hurdles? That is one of the questions I am exploring. Without a question - YES. Having owned previous gens, and in the market later this year for a new one, and having driven it's competition...YES again. I believe even Honda realizes how good they are, as they started heavily discounting 07s and 08s Odys last fall. GM is in the strongest position, but they are all bleeding cash. Buying a Toyota, Honda or Nissan I would be confident that the manufacturer will be around to support the vehicle for a long time to come. You might want to cheer up some and not be so dire here...... GM is bleeding cash only because of accounting issues. They'll be around long after our bones are dust. Nissan was given up for dead years ago before Renault stepped in. Chrysler is taking the steps needed to grow the business and they have the cash. Once this economy picks up they'll be fine. |
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Replying to: yatesjo (Feb 26, 2008 11:14 pm) No one is asking anyone to buy an American vehicle that is priced higher or inferior in quality. Please go to Domestic/Foreign and read the posts I put up. There is where we should be discussing this anyway. Thanks. |
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Replying to: dennisctc (Feb 26, 2008 1:52 pm) In a true comparo they would pick a winner from one of the cars tested. |
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Replying to: dennisctc (Feb 26, 2008 4:02 pm) It's not just CR that gets "used to" an interior layout, it's everyone. Simple ergonomics make you feel right at home, right away. There's no having to get used to it. You inherently know where things are, it becomes 2nd instinct. For the most part, Japanese makes have indeed copied each other, or at least standardized on a basic layout. The headlight switches are all in the same place, the wiper switches, the cruise (in most cases). Koreans hopped on this bandwagon. Even some domestic cars have caved. Good Example: hop out of a Mazda, and into a Subaru, and all the controls are in the same place. Then go to a Honda, again, you're right at home. And to a Toyota, and so on. You don't have to go looking for wiper controls. This is good ergonomics. Bad Example: you're in a Mercedes, and have to look for the light switch, which is on the dash instead of on a stalk. Then you get in a Porsche, and can't find the key hole, which is left of the steering wheel. Then you go drive a Saab, and the key goes in - the center console? And you can't get it out, until you realize the shifter has to be in Reverse. Then your 7 series Bimmer has a bizarre looking shift selector that takes a while to figure out. I haven't even brought up iDrive or any of those devices. If you need a manual to figure something out, it's not intuitive. Bad ergonomics. If you can get used to a certain layout, and move from car to car and feel at home instantly. Well, that's just good ergonomic design. Notice I didn't criticize domestics - that's because I think the Europeans commit far more sins in that regard. |
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| ...if you're done talking about 2008 minivans, it's time to shut this down. I don't see any new folks wandering in with questions. You can go to the other discussion I linked to the other day to continue your Minivans-Domestic vs. Foreign debate. | |
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