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Midsize Sedans 2.0

13232 messages,  Last post on Nov 26, 2009 at 10:26 PM

You are in the Sedans Forum. Your Hosts are pat & karens

What is this discussion about? Hyundai Sonata, Toyota Camry, Honda Accord, Nissan Altima, Volkswagen Passat, Mazda MAZDA6, Ford Fusion, Chevrolet Malibu, Saturn Aura, Car Comparisons, Sedan


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#8746 of 13232
Re: Car and driver comparison joke [kdshapiro] by targettuning
Feb 08, 2008 (10:05 am)
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Replying to: kdshapiro (Feb 08, 2008 9:43 am)

I guess if you think the Accord leads "the pack" due to these intangible feelings then what you say might have merit. While some here will state that they buy their cars largely or even partially due to these "feelings" most people do not. An Accord to "Joe average" driving the 4/10ths way "Joe average" does especially with the kiddies in the car will feel much like a Malibu or a Sonata or a Camry or any other mainstream family sedan. These "feelings" don't mean squat to the majority of family car buyers. I don't believe there is a family sedan sold that would call to the attention of "Joe average" that it truly "feels" a whole lot better or a whole lot worse than any other. Maybe these subjective feelings mean more the potential BMW or Mercedes driver but not so much to "ole Joe" I think.
#8747 of 13232
Re: Car and driver comparison joke [targettuning] by targettuning
Feb 08, 2008 (10:30 am)
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Replying to: targettuning (Feb 08, 2008 10:05 am)

Rereading your post I responded mostly with regard to the "fun to drive" category in CD. Since you used BMW as an example I figured that was the one you were trying to defend. The "gotta have it" is a goofy category that in my opinion has no place in a family sedan test. Gotta have a Camry/Accord/Sonata/Malibu/Jetta etc. more than any other family car in existance? Give me a break! I would probably prefer one or two over the others but "GOTTA HAVE IT!!"?? Maybe in a Corvette...Viper comparison I'd get that emotional.
#8748 of 13232
Re: Car and driver comparison joke [targettuning] by akirby
Feb 08, 2008 (10:47 am)
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Replying to: targettuning (Feb 08, 2008 10:30 am)

"GOTTA HAVE IT!!"?? Maybe in a Corvette...Viper comparison I'd get that emotional.
 
Make that GOTTA HAVE IT vs. CAN'T GET IT. Rumor is Chrysler is cutting half it's vehicles starting with the Viper.
 
And to keep it on topic - not sure if that includes the Avenger/Sebring or not, but it wouldn't surprise me.
#8749 of 13232
"gotta have it" by jeffyscott
Feb 08, 2008 (10:47 am)
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Replying to: targettuning (Feb 08, 2008 10:05 am)

While "gotta have it" is a silly rating category, I think you are mistaken if you think cars are not bought based on subjective criteria. It may be different criteria from what C&D think are important, but I really think for most people choosing one car over another comes down to many subjective judgements.
 
What objective criteria do people typically look at? Price, size, mpg...maybe certain performance numbers. (Expected reliability is kind of a hybrid, partly objective and partly subjective, IMO). Most other stuff I can think of is subjective: styling, materials, ride, handling, seat comfort, convenience.
#8750 of 13232
Re: Car and driver comparison joke [targettuning] by kdshapiro
Feb 08, 2008 (11:00 am)
Reply

Replying to: targettuning (Feb 08, 2008 10:05 am)

While some here will state that they buy their cars largely or even partially due to these "feelings" most people do not
 
I'll challenge that remark as you really don't know what criteria "all" people use to buy cars. You might know the criteria of a few of your friends.
 
These "feelings" don't mean squat to the majority of family car buyers
 
You can validate this statement how?
 
Maybe these subjective feelings mean more the potential BMW or Mercedes driver but not so much to "ole Joe" I think.
 
OK, you did add I think to the end.
#8751 of 13232
Re: "gotta have it" [jeffyscott] by kdshapiro
Feb 08, 2008 (11:02 am)
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Replying to: jeffyscott (Feb 08, 2008 10:47 am)

You hit the nail on the head. Anyone who doesn't think a whole bunch of subjectdive criteria is not used in car buying is severly misinformed.
#8752 of 13232
Re: Car and driver comparison joke [akirby] by tedebear
Feb 08, 2008 (2:26 pm)
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Replying to: akirby (Feb 08, 2008 10:47 am)

And to keep it on topic - not sure if that includes the Avenger/Sebring or not, but it wouldn't surprise me.
 
I heard last month that the Viper might be getting a temporary axe (GM brought back the Camaro) to free up some money to enhance the Sebring.
#8753 of 13232
Re: Car and driver comparison joke [targettuning] by elroy5
Feb 08, 2008 (2:41 pm)
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Replying to: targettuning (Feb 08, 2008 9:27 am)

The ALL NEW Accord was numerically in front due partially to two subjective category scores...the "gotta have it" and "fun to drive" . Both of these are intangibles with no real measurable winner other than the "feelings" of the several drivers assigned to the test. If one uses the measurable scores the Sonata would have been much closer numerically to #1.
 
When you buy a car, do you go by a numerical scoring system? If you do, the Sonata may be the perfect car for you. Going by the number of Accords sold each year, many people use their "feelings" and "intagibles" to decide. If you are only going by the numbers, there would be no need for a test drive. You could just get the numbers from comparison tests, apply them to your own system, and go out and buy that car.
#8754 of 13232
Re: Car and driver comparison joke [backy] by according2u06
Feb 08, 2008 (2:44 pm)
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Replying to: backy (Feb 08, 2008 8:16 am)

Well, I guess it's just a bit of everything, handling(the obvious one), engine & transmission refinement, quality interior materials used, gauge display etc. Note my brother does not own either car and little info was given to him, and I never drove the Sonata, so I can't say much here.
 
By the way, I thought the 2009 Sonata is the 'redesigned' model, and the 08 Accord beat them again? Or is it just the mid cycle 'refresh'? If so the Sonata could catch up earlier than I think they might if they indeed address all the shortcomings of the current model.
#8755 of 13232
Re: Car and driver comparison joke [elroy5] by busiris
Feb 08, 2008 (2:53 pm)
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Replying to: elroy5 (Feb 08, 2008 2:41 pm)

Just to add my 2 cents worth on this issue....
 
Seems to me that, if the majority of folks buy a car primarily based upon the technical and quantitative scores a car gets, then the car getting the highest score each year would also be the best selling...assuming prices are relatively even between models.
 
Looks like a simple theory to prove or disprove. My guess is that sales don't follow technical scoring data in a 1 to 1 correlation....I think you will find that people also include other factors in their decision making process, such as previous brand experience, dealer treatment and reputation, etc...

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