Last post on Dec 10, 2013 at 5:02 PM
You are in the Sedans
What is this discussion about?
Hyundai Sonata, Toyota Camry, Honda Accord, Nissan Altima, Volkswagen Passat, Mazda MAZDA6, Ford Fusion, Chevrolet Malibu, Kia Optima, Car Comparisons, Sedan
#7191 of 20239 Re: Lighter cars - Sustainable Zoom Zoom [captain2]
Nov 12, 2007 (10:27 am)
if you really don't think that Ford's financial problems do effect Mazda's ability to to fulfill its promise for a better V6 in the 08 6 (you said so yourself)
I never said why the launch of the new Mazda6 was not on par with the rest of the world, because I do not know. No one does. You are forgetting that Mazda makes it's own money, and spends it own money. Do we really know if Ford's financial status effects what Mazda does in Japan?
According to rumors, the only real difference from the Euro/Japanese Mazda6 will be the V6 engine. Now, is Mazda going to use the 3.7 sourced from Japan, or the 3.5 sourced from the U.S.? We don't know. Also, did Mazda push back the launch of the 6 so it did not clash with the Accord? That is another rumor. If that were true, it's a good thing they did that. In this segment, you want to make the biggest splash upon arrival. The Accord most certainly did that. Then there is the AWD speculation. With the CX's selling strong, and demand increasing, AWD systems are scarce.
if you don't think that the 6 and the Fusion are close to identical mechanically then I guess the marketing people did their job
The current 2003-2008 Mazda6 and Ford Fusion are very similar. Same Mazda platform, and engine choices. The D23 is a Mazda design, and the D30 is Ford's. Tranny's are different as well as suspension/materials/design. The up-comming Mazda6 uses a Volvo platform, recently used in the new Ford Mondeo in Europe. If you have not seen the Mondeo, you need to take a look. Whatta car that is. In Europe, Ford's have a strong reputation for reliability and quality.
#7192 of 20239 Re: Powerful Debate [thegraduate]
Nov 12, 2007 (10:29 am)
Grad- think you will have a hard time finding anybody that doesn't know that Honda makes and has made the best small engines for many years. I was thinking more about a comparison of that Ecotec (or Hyundai's/Chrysler's 'world engine'/Ford-Mazda's 2.3s) you mentioned to the Nissan and Toyota 4 bangers which are not shabby either. I wouldn't even think of comparing a Honda engine (4 banger) to pretty much anything else made on this planet - their expertise in building a small engine is legendary and why they make such good lawnmowers !
#7193 of 20239 Re: Lighter cars - Sustainable Zoom Zoom [captain2]
Nov 12, 2007 (10:31 am)
Not sure what your point is, do you expect Mazda to put a V6 in the new 6 for the rest of the world, where no one wants this?
To me rather than underpowered engines in the rest of the world, I would say that only in the US do over-powered FWD family sedans sell.
As was pointed out the majority of buyers of the two (maybe 3?) most popular midsize sedans have found the 150-170 HP 4 cyl to be adequate for the job. You have a fixation on V6 and HP that most buyers don't seem to share, in the end.
#7194 of 20239 Re: Lighter cars - Sustainable Zoom Zoom [captain2]
Nov 12, 2007 (10:42 am)
This topic just keeps getting funnier (and more ignorant) as it keeps moving along!
personally I would suggest to you that that 'straight line' capability is what most drivers will find more useful whether its passing a semi on a 2 lane or merging on the highway that happens to be moving at 80!
I happen to drive a lot of two-lane roads and highways as part of my commute and with weekend jaunts. Not once, and I'll repeat, NOT ONCE has my V6-equipped Mazda6 let me down when I needed more power, both in the instances you just described, and in thousands of other situations when I needed to get up and go. 50 HP may mean something on paper, but where it counts ON THE ROAD, the difference is negligible at best.
Ever since the MX5/Probe days back in the late 80s and early 90s the Mazdas have always had 'Ford' Vulcan and DT V6s - something that I contend has hurt the Mazda6 ( and 626) in the showrooms. It sure has kept me away.
No. What's hurt the Mazda6 in showrooms is the fact that it's 9/10th the size of the behemoth CamCords. Since the vast majority of this segment buys I-4's and avoids the V6, AFAIC the V6 is not an issue, nor will it be when the '09 model debuts.
I personally have owned a number of Mazdas and even a Probe and have always thought that Mazda has been a good product that has been hurt by Dearborn.
As proven on this forum about a thousand times now, MAZDA AND FORD ARE TWO DIFFERENT COMPANIES. Different philosophies, different management teams, etc. And also as repeated before, Mazda WOULD NOT EXIST had it not been for Ford purchasing a share of their stock and investing some much-needed $$$$. It's not a marketing "scheme", it's no joke, or "Fordspeak", its FACT. Whether or not you choose to believe it is your choice, but don't bash something that you obviously know nothing about and are too ignorant to understand fully.
#7195 of 20239 Re: Lighter cars - Sustainable Zoom Zoom [aviboy97]
Nov 12, 2007 (10:44 am)
According to rumors = Ford/Mazda speak.
of course the 'new' Mazda6 would be based on some sort of Volvo platform - Ford already did that with the S80/500-Taurus - not that platform sharing is necessarily bad or unusual - if the platform is good enough - the majority of Nissan/Infiniti models are all based in some degree on what they call the 'FM' platform, and quite successfully. From what I understand Ford Europe is the only wholly owned Ford subsidiary that actually makes money (Rover?) . I don't know much about the Mondeo as I also understand that it is not destined for the US but I do read that it is a helluva car...
#7196 of 20239 Re: Powerful Debate [captain2]
Nov 12, 2007 (10:52 am)
The up-comming Mazda6 uses a Volvo platform, recently used in the new Ford Mondeo in Europe.
Besides your dealer connections, where else did you get this info. A number of other sources, including automotive journalists across the pond, say that the '09 6 is based on a revised version of the current platform.
#7197 of 20239 Re: AWD [robertsmx]
Nov 12, 2007 (10:55 am)
You might want to revisit "facts". I'm not interested in discussing Ford's commercials.
Just because you can't comprehend the "facts" about how Ford's AWD system works doesn't mean it's a "commercial". The system works as advertised by sending torque to the rear wheels to help handling and to help prevent slip from occurring under certain conditions. End of discussion. Move on.
#7198 of 20239 Re: Powerful Debate [mz6greyghost]
Nov 12, 2007 (10:56 am)
Haven't you noticed that the people who complain the most about Ford (and Mazda) are the ones that know the least about them?
#7199 of 20239 Re: Lighter cars - Sustainable Zoom Zoom [mz6greyghost]
Nov 12, 2007 (10:56 am)
If Ford and Mazda are different companies then why are they producing cars that except for a few inches and some suspension bits are otherwise identical?. Or FTM, why, if they are different companies, does Mazda seem to have the same sort of problems getting a competitive V6 in the car? I don't know for a FACT (as you say) what kind of financial condition that Mazda was in back in the late 80s when Ford commissioned them to build the new Mustang (later became the Probe) , the only thing that seems to be apparent to this Mazda fan is that Ford ( and perhaps its financial problems) is 'holding back' what used to be an innovative car mfgr.
#7200 of 20239 Re: Lighter cars - Sustainable Zoom Zoom [captain2]
Nov 12, 2007 (11:00 am)
According to rumors = Ford/Mazda speak.
I have gathered rumors from forums, magazines, and from what my rep's at Mazda have hinted to. I really only take what my rep says seriously. I cannot get any of my Mazda hierarchy to spill the beans on what they plan to do, officially. Does this mean they don't know what going on? No. It just means they are not ready to let everyone know what they are up to. What's wrong with that? Every company does that.