Last post on Dec 09, 2013 at 12:40 PM
You are in the Sedans
What is this discussion about?
Hyundai Sonata, Toyota Camry, Honda Accord, Nissan Altima, Volkswagen Passat, Mazda MAZDA6, Ford Fusion, Chevrolet Malibu, Kia Optima, Car Comparisons, Sedan
#2790 of 20230 Re: 2008 Honda Accord [akirby]
Jul 03, 2007 (11:38 am)
I'm sure that Ford and Hyundai are both making great strides in quality when it comes to their midsize sedan offerings. The intital quality reports sure seem to bear that out. However, I for one won't be convinced until 2012, when I can check the long-term reliability ratings of the 2006 Sonata and Fusion. If they are still rated as good as Honda and Toyota vehicles of the same vintage, then I'll certainly consider whatever midsize sedans Hyundia and Ford are offering in 2012, so long as they are still receiving high "initial quality" ratings.
#2791 of 20230 Re: 2008 Honda Accord [akirby]
Jul 03, 2007 (11:42 am)
I think they've learned to under promise and over achieve.
Being a "Ford guy" myself I see exactly where you are coming from ackirby. However, the general consumer needs a lot of convincing to go back to a domestic vehicle at this point. That is where the real challenge lies. The Accord and Camry are still very well executed products and all the others really need to show the Honda and Toyota faithful that they need to try the other guys too.
The recent good press will help but it ain't gonna work on its own. And I have yet to see anything from the big three, marketing wise, that would make me say WOW I gotta have one of those! So maybe leaking this info will help too but they do need to deliver while it's still on people's minds and that doesn't leave a whole lot of time between leak and release.
#2792 of 20230 Re: 2008 Honda Accord [benderofbows]
Jul 03, 2007 (11:45 am)
If they are still rated as good as Honda and Toyota vehicles of the same vintage, then I'll certainly consider whatever midsize sedans Hyundia and Ford are offering in 2012, so long as they are still receiving high "initial quality" ratings.
So what would you buy now? The Accord isn't tops at CR or J.D. anymore IIRC. It is still high in the ratings but don't you want the best?
#2794 of 20230 Re: Sweeter music? [andres3]
Jul 03, 2007 (12:01 pm)
Folks like the editors of Edmunds.com disagree with you on that one. They have multiple Hyundais as their "Most Wanted" for 2007.
Also, the facts disagree with you. Take a look for example at the EPA charts--Sonata is #1 in its EPA class. Elantra (considered by EPA a mid-sized car) is near the top of its EPA class.
You also forgot some categories that are important for mid-sized sedan buyers--not everyone is focused on power, for example. The Sonata has class-leading standard safety equipment. Important for many people. I think it may also be tops in this class in interior room--also important for many people. Also tops (tied with Optima and Galant) for warranty coverage--important for many people.
#2795 of 20230 Re: 2008 Honda Accord [benderofbows]
Jul 03, 2007 (12:04 pm)
Coming off of that experience, I had trouble seriously considering a less expensive Ford sedan, or any Ford for that matter.
Bender, what's the old investment saying, "Past experience is no guarantee of future performance?" Even so, given your experiences with the Explorer, I, too, would be leery of Ford products.
Our experience with past and present Ford products has been quite good for the most part -- a fuel pump here, an alternator there, regular maintenance items, brakes, batteries, tires (but no abnormal wear).
We now have an exceptional Ford, Lincoln, Mercury dealer in town, Sherwood of Salisbury (Md.) and that played a big part in our decision to buy a new 2007 SEL AWD V6 Fusion from them. Many times a car or truck is only going to be as good as the dealer that backs it up. Apparently, you had a problem in that area as well, unfortunately for both you and the FoMoCo.
Previous bad experiences often tip the scale when it comes time to purchase a car, either new or previously owned. The fine track record for Accords and Camrys serves their manufacturers well and is a huge contributing factor to their continued position as sales leaders in the mid-size sedan segment.
It's highly unlikely that any of the other manufacturers will overtake Accord and Camry unless Honda and Toyota really screw something up, especially in the power train department.
Although styling, handling are important, the most crucial factor of vehicle ownership may well be reliability. Except for poor in-city mileage, 14.8 mpg, our Fusion has been perfect for seven months and its first 3,700 miles. Yes, I'm knocking on wood.
Will it be that way at 37,000 miles or 107,000 miles? No one knows but the longest journey begins with a single step.
#2796 of 20230 Re: 2008 Honda Accord [urnews]
Jul 03, 2007 (12:26 pm)
...and folks, here is your moment of Zen.
No one knows but the longest journey begins with a single step.
#2797 of 20230 Re: 2008 Honda Accord [akirby]
Jul 03, 2007 (12:28 pm)
I was referring to quality and it wouldn't matter if the Fusion was twice as good as the Camcords in every possible category - they aren't going to win over Camcord loyalists overnight.
Actually, Ford would win loyalists overnight from all manufacturers if they were able to be TWICE as good! Let's look at what twice as good as an Accord would be... (A 5 year old design by the way).
488 HP and 430 lb/ft of torque while getting 40/60 mpg, oh yeah baby!
A warranty of 6 years or 72K miles, with a powertrain warranty of 8 years and 120K miles! Oh yes, more please!
A price tag half that of the Accord... so I should be able to get a top of the line Fusion for around $14K out the door! I'm buying!
#2798 of 20230 Re: 2008 Honda Accord [akirby]
Jul 03, 2007 (12:45 pm)
Quality is in the eyes of the beholder. While I don't see the Fusion as non-quality, it doesn't match up to Camry or Accord. (IMHO, and I guess a lot of "CamCord" buyers agree)
#2799 of 20230 Re: Sweeter music? [leadfoot6]
Jul 03, 2007 (12:55 pm)
You make it sound like there are NO Sonatas sitting on dealers' lots beacause every one they make is being snatched up quickly, and they can't make enough of them.
Where did I ever say that? You're twisting my words. What I said were facts - capacity constraints and higher demand of I4s. Confirm with Hyundai if you'd like.
The latest June sales report the Sonata up 28% so looks like they are making up the 4 cylinder shortage.