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Midsize Sedans 2.0

18175 messages,  Last post on May 20, 2013 at 4:45 AM

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What is this discussion about? Hyundai Sonata, Toyota Camry, Honda Accord, Nissan Altima, Volkswagen Passat, Mazda MAZDA6, Ford Fusion, Chevrolet Malibu, Kia Optima, Car Comparisons, Sedan

Messages Page 1662 of 1818

#16611 of 18175 Re: Tale of two Altimas [backy] by smarty666

Oct 28, 2011 (4:36 pm)

Replying to: backy (Oct 27, 2011 5:41 pm)
Rental cars aren't the best determination as they all are not taken care of, properly maintained, and they are beat to heck by everyone who uses them. I've had the same experience you had with a Camry, Malibu, and a Fusion rental but I don't go on questioning why people buy those vehicles, its a little presumptuous to do so. Actually, if you look at this C&D article, the altima was not any louder than the other ones at full throttle and cruise.
 
Plus, I see just as many Camry's, Fusion's, and Malibu's as rental car fodder like I do the Altima. It has nothing to do with the car, but the incentive spending Toyota, Nissan, Ford, and GM have. The domestics still lead the pack in that respect.
 
Seat comfort is another highly subject quality. I found the seats in the Altima pretty comfortable, but the ones in the Accord and Sonata to be too firm and uncomfortable after just a few minutes.
 
http://media.caranddriver.com/files/2008-honda-accord-vs-nissan-altima-chevy-mal- ibu-hyundai-sonata-toyota-camry-ford-fusion-dodge-avengerthe-buzzard-and-baloney- -brigade-1.pdf

#16612 of 18175 Re: Tale of two Altimas [smarty666] by backy

Oct 28, 2011 (5:31 pm)

Replying to: smarty666 (Oct 28, 2011 4:36 pm)
Rental cars are not properly maintained? Really? What do you base that on?
 
I think that how a rental car holds up under a year plus of hard use is a great indicator of how it will hold up in multiple years' use for someone like me. I've driven many rental cars with 25K+ miles. Some were like brand new. Others were gently worn, as you'd expect for a car with 25k+ miles. Then there's that Altima in Dallas...
 
One of the reasons I started paying attention to Hyundai was a Gen 2 Elantra rental in 2000 in Dallas. It had about 25k miles on it. But it was tight, rattle-free, nothing falling off, interior and exterior still looked like new. That was not long after I had rented a brand-new Focus in Chicago that literally had parts falling off it.
 
As for the Altima, one trait all of them (all 2.5s) I've rented shared, no matter what the mileage, is that the engines clatter like an old diesel warming up and on acceleration. No other mid-sized cars I've driven do that. The Altima I rented in KC this week was quite nice (the one with 15k miles) except for the noisy engine. But nothing special. I'd take a Fusion, Accord, Mazda6, Sonata, Optima, or Legacy over it in a minute (and maybe a Passat and 2012 Camry, but I haven't driven those yet).

#16613 of 18175 Re: Tale of two Altimas [mannygo] by backy

Oct 28, 2011 (5:35 pm)

Replying to: mannygo (Oct 28, 2011 1:00 pm)
I've driven many 2011-12 rental Sonatas. Some brand new, some with 20-25k+ miles. I've liked all of them. Maybe because they were GLSes with 16" wheels. The Sonatas with larger wheels may have a harsher ride. Also I liked the styling (inside and out), interior room, driving position, power, handling, and fuel economy. All were better than the Altimas I drove this week. But I have a hard time finding them when I rent cars. Probably because I usually have to rent from Hertz and they don't have many/any Hyundais in their fleet anymore.

#16614 of 18175 Re: Tale of two Altimas [backy] by smarty666

Oct 28, 2011 (5:51 pm)

Replying to: backy (Oct 28, 2011 5:31 pm)
Yes, we all know you love Hyundai, something you like to remind us of at every opportunity.
 
I'd take the Altima over the Camry, Malibu, Accord, or Fusion any day. My point is, your experience proves nothing. Rental cars are properly maintained, what world do you live in? I've had some with two bald tires (never rotated properly), completely warped/grinding rotors, burning oil odors because the oil was never change, no windshield wiper fluid, need I go on? I have a Maxima with 27k miles, nothing is falling off, rattle free, interior and exterior look like new, etc but I take care of it.
 
I had two rental cars recently, a Camry and Malibu where the console actually detached off in my hands. Even Hyundai is guilty of incentive spending and I've started to see the new Sonata creep in to the rental lots. The only one that is harder to find as a rental is the Accord.
 
I'll agree, the Altima is starting to show its age, its the oldest in the midsize sedan segment now, so its not's going to be as nice and flashy as a brand new Sonata or Camry, but they are newer models. But, the Altima is still selling well and gets decent reviews across the board from CR, C&D, MT, JDP, etc. I'm actually not crazy about the new Camry, but never have been to begin with, too boring.

#16615 of 18175 Re: Tale of two Altimas [smarty666] by backy

Oct 28, 2011 (6:00 pm)

Replying to: smarty666 (Oct 28, 2011 5:51 pm)
I have a Maxima with 27k miles, nothing is falling off, rattle free, interior and exterior look like new, etc but I take care of it.
 
"Your experience proves nothing."
 
I take care of my cars also (including my daily driver, a NISSAN Sentra). So if a car can hold up under 25K or more of hard rental use, that's a plus in my book. That's all I'm trying to say. Also that some cars have, in my 25 years' experience in renting hundreds of cars, held up better than others.
 
Actually I think the Galant might be the oldest mid-sized design now (not that anyone cares), followed by the Fusion. But a new Fusion is coming soon. When will the new Altima be here?

#16616 of 18175 Re: 2012 Camry [m6user] by baggs32

Oct 28, 2011 (8:44 pm)

Replying to: m6user (Oct 27, 2011 9:44 am)
"You thought the styling on the Optima was nice until you sat in it? What does sitting in a car have to do with the exterior styling which is what I was talking about?"
 
Initially I thought the Optima itself was nice and worth a look based on the exterior styling. Then I sat in it. I hated the interior. The interior of our '11 Fusion isn't anything to write home about but it was a lot less offending and more modern looking than the Optima's IMO. The whole IP integrated with the center console look has to go just as it did once before in the 80s.
 
"I realize styling is subjective but I think the vast majority would agree the Sonata styling has been a tremendous hit since being introduced. Sales numbers bear that out as well."
 
I do recognize that but I still think the design is awful and as you've probably read in another post I'm not alone. It looks like a blob that hit a wall to me. People buy the Camry and Accord in droves so basing sales on styling holds no ground to me.
 
I give Hyundai/Kia credit for going to an I4 lineup though. Looks like most mfrs are following suit and I think that's the way to go. I was always a more displacement is better type of guy but our Fusion is an I4 and it has plenty of power for us. It's also a hoot to drive which is something the Sonota and Optima can't claim based on reviews I've read.

#16617 of 18175 Re: 2012 Camry [baggs32] by m6user

Oct 28, 2011 (10:17 pm)

Replying to: baggs32 (Oct 28, 2011 8:44 pm)
I was STRICTLY talking about the Sonata/Optima exterior styling of which the VAST majority(I know you will read others that don't like it) seem to like including just about every professional auto reviewer. Camry and Accord sales are based on their longevity and perception of reliability...not styling. The reason I cited Sonata/Optima sales is that it is because of their styling that sales have taken off like crazy. Same with Elantra. I realize the drivetrains changed for 2011 but that isn't what generated all the buzz and subsequent sales. I don't own or even plan on buying any of them but have to give them their kudos for something they're doing right.
 
Re the Optima interior. I'll agree it has, from what I've read, about a 50-50 like/dislike ratio. You say the Optima dash is offending? I don't think I've ever in my life been offended by a dash or interior of any car. Didn't like, sure, but offended? I personally like the "cockpit" feel in the Optima versus the swooping dash of the Sonata but that's just me and I don't try to come off as an authority on style.

#16618 of 18175 Re: Tale of two Altimas [smarty666] by gooddeal2

Oct 29, 2011 (6:01 am)

Replying to: smarty666 (Oct 28, 2011 4:36 pm)
Rental cars aren't the best determination as they all are not taken care of, properly maintained, and they are beat to heck by everyone who uses them.
 
I agree. If people think that rental cars are in better shape than their cars, they probably didn't wash, detail or maintain their cars for the last 2 years.
 
I used to drive rental cars a lot in early 2000s and they all looked like $hit b/c renters like to abuse these cars so much. One of my friends likes to floor his rental cars every time he can. He even used the from quarter panel to scrape out the mud from his shoes.

#16619 of 18175 Re: Tale of two Altimas [backy] by smarty666

Oct 29, 2011 (9:36 am)

Replying to: backy (Oct 28, 2011 6:00 pm)
I'm actually not sure. Nissan has moved back to 6 yr model design cycles so I figure by the summer/fall of next year the 2013 Altima will arrive. I think around the same time will be getting the 2013 Malibu redesign as well.
 
As I've tried to point out, your bashing an entire car model that sells more than 250k models per year that constantly gets good to great reviews and rankings, especially considering its 6 years old.
 
I'm not that crazy about this segment though as too many of any of these mid sizer's end up on the road. I like to stay with the premium sedan and ELLPS segments so that I have a car that is not so numerous, but that is just me.

#16620 of 18175 Re: Tale of two Altimas [smarty666] by backy

Oct 29, 2011 (10:09 am)

Replying to: smarty666 (Oct 29, 2011 9:36 am)
As I've tried to point out, your bashing an entire car model ...
 
The title of my original post was, "Tale of two Altimas." Not sure how you can call that bashing of an entire car model. I talked about how nice one rental Altima was and how bad the other was. I also noted that every current gen Altima 2.5 I've driven, regardless of miles, has a raucous engine on warmup and acceleration. Even that isn't bashing an entire car model as it only relates to the 2.5's with CVT, not to 2.5 sticks or V6s, as I haven't driven those.
 
Anyway, I am entitled to my opinion of the cars I drive just as much as you are. If you don't want to read my opinions, use the Page Down key. Or go to the Sentra discussion and see my posts there if you are only interested in "feeling the love" for Nissan and not reading anything negative about the brand. Oh wait... I think I've said a few negative things about my Sentra there in addition to positive things. So forget that idea.

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