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Automotive News & Views Are gas prices fueling your pain? 
10042 messages, Last post on Jul 12, 2008 at 3:07 PM
You are in the Automotive News & Views Forum. Your Hosts are steve_ & claires
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Replying to: snakeweasel (Jul 10, 2008 2:31 pm) Is that the place of, "Cheeburger, Cheeburger, Cheeburger, Pepsi-no Coke"?
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Replying to: tpe (Jul 10, 2008 4:32 am) We could say that is the one billion USD question. Car industry is growing very fast and is representing millions of well paid jobs, hence huge tax revenue and direct/indirect economic activity. Everyone in China dreams to have a car and how far people are ready to go for it is beyond my imagination. China being not a democracy, the govt must purchase its legitimacy. They just can not or are not willing to educate people into the true cost of gas. Car lobby is already too powerful. the recent price increase is a conservative adjustment to $140 a barrel, but no room was added so any further barrel increase means govt companies paying for the difference. Even if managed to break even by increasing sticker price quicker, I consider not adding a serious gas tax a kind of subsidy. I speculate that we won't see any such tax before at least 5 years, while it is possible sticker prices will evolve a bit quicker to limit hard losses. > also believe these countries that are encouraging the expansion of automobile use and oil consumption are making a big long term mistake. It is going to hurt everybody. We are just , only just, starting to see a tip of it. |
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Replying to: oregonboy (Jul 09, 2008 11:22 pm) Some of us are still waiting for it to get there. $3.99 was the highest I've ever seen it locally. It was back down to $3.87 today.
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Replying to: xrunner2 (Jul 10, 2008 5:55 am) I have trouble associating buses with mass transit. Imho this is the cheaper end of a real mass transit system where heavy rail would be the backbone and light rail plays an arterial role. Gas/Diesel/GNV buses are good to complement those but can't be a backbone by themselves unless dealing with a small city. The problem of buses is that they share the very same roads than other cars and trucks so they face the same limitations of speed and traffic. In Germany, most cities above 200K inhabitants have at least a railway station and some electric light rail. reaching 1 million will likely make a subway possible. Greater distances in the US demand that the problem be addressed differently, but there are many situation where higher populated areas would justify the investment. |
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Replying to: xrunner2 (Jul 10, 2008 4:31 pm) No in their own words: 
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just how much of a pain in the backside buses and trains can be. My roommate is going back to Detroit to visit his friends and family. He figured he'd take the train, but waited until the last minute to get his reservation. There's only one train that leaves DC in that direction per day, and I think the closest it gets him is Toledo, Ohio. Well, that train was all booked up. I told him to look into leaving from Baltimore. He did, but it turns out it was the same danged train! It goes from Baltimore to DC, and then on out west. Well, I'm going up to Pennsylvania tomorrow for a car show, and I told him to check out Harrisburg. As it turns out, you guessed it, it's the same. damn. train!  He also looked into taking a bus, but that would've been about $200 round trip. And since there wouldn't be anyone around to give him a ride, he would have had to take a taxi into DC, which I'm sure wouldn't be cheap. I think the bus ride would've been 12-13 hours, and the train was about the same. Geeze, I think you can drive it in 9-10! Anyway, he decided on flying. It was about $300. Gets him out there in under two hours. Only down-side is that his flight leaves at 6:10, and I have to get up at 4 to take him up there. I have a feeling tomorrow's gonna be a loooong day! Just for kicks, I did a rough estimate on what it would cost to drive out there. It's about 540 miles. My Intrepid can get about 30 mpg on the highway if I don't push it too hard. Still, at around $4.10/gal for 87 octane, it would cost about $150 just in fuel to drive out there and back.
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Replying to: tedebear (Jul 10, 2008 5:21 pm) One good hurricane (but looks like it won't be Bertha thank goodness. What a name for a hurricane!) and we might yet see spikes to $5+ before Labor Day. |
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Replying to: andre1969 (Jul 10, 2008 6:23 pm) This frequency may be found on some little railways stations deep in French countryside. This shows how train transport is abandoned to oblivion in the US. Standard frequency should be 1 train per hour. >Anyway, he decided on flying this basically represents about 4 hours and I am not sure the transit time from airport to final destination is included or not. High speed train would reasonably take 3 hours, adding the transit time from and to railway station, which makes a draw. To throw in comparisons with prices in Europe, Paris to Marseilles (800 km = 500 miles) would take about 8 hours by car. Return cost for gas and toll would be 315 Euros (as calculated by mappy.fr) Otoh we could expect return high speed train ticket price to be around 200 Euros for 3 hours journey time. Taking the train is definitely interesting for one person, while for 2, driving is a bit cheaper if we don't count extra cost (dining), while the difference between 3 hours train and 8 hours drive is a matter of personal tastes.
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Replying to: vchiu (Jul 10, 2008 9:29 pm) Standard frequency should be 1 train per hour. Oh it gets better. My friend could take the train directly to Detroit if he wanted to. The only problem is, he would have to go to Chicago first and then transfer, and go back to Detroit. I think that stretched the trip out from 13 hours or so to more like 20-21! Amazing. I mean, this sounds more like the Hooterville Cannonball than American rail travel in the 21st century! Or, you can get off the train in Toledo and take a bus to Detroit, which is quicker, but adds about $100. So suddenly, that $200 train ride is up to $300. this basically represents about 4 hours and I am not sure the transit time from airport to final destination is included or not. High speed train would reasonably take 3 hours, adding the transit time from and to railway station, which makes a draw. Well, I left the house at around 4:30 to get him to the airport, and his flight left around 6:10. I think it touches down around 7:50 in Detroit. And by the time he gets his luggage and gets picked up, I'd guess it could very well be 9:00 by the time he actually gets to where he's staying. So yeah, total trip time is at least 4 hours. Still, to get him to Union Station in DC to catch the train or bus, it would probably take me about a half hour to get down there and drop him off. How far ahead of time do you have to arrive if you're taking a bus or train? Is it similar to flying, where they tell you to get there at least an hour early? As an aside, I had to fill up my Intrepid on the way to the airport, as it was getting pretty low. Paid $4.079 per gallon at the local Shell. It gulped down about 14.7 gallons, and averaged about 23.5 mpg. Total bill came out to around $57. That's for about 16 days worth of driving though, so I guess it's not as bad as it sounds. I'm about to repeat the process though, with a '79 New Yorker that I'm taking to a Chrysler show. I want a full tank before I hit the highways. I have a feeling that fill-up's gonna be painful! 
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My wife and I, and another couple, are traveling to Steamboat Springs this weekend for the Balloon Festival. It's about 180 miles from our town to Steamboat, but each couple is taking their own car - we're taking our VUE and the other couple have the new style Santa Fe. We figure it'll be two tanks of gas for the weekend - about $100. The local station here in town raised prices over the 4th of July weekend and RUG is now at $3.95/gal. I'm almost certain it will be over $4/gal where we're going - the mountain towns in Colorado are always more expensive than the urban areas. To offset the price of the gas, we're staying at an Inn that has a kitchenette so we can prepare some of our meals and avoid going out to restaurants. |
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