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SUVs Honda CR-V Honda CR-V Rear Differential Problem?
395 messages, Last post on Nov 27, 2009 at 8:41 PM
You are in the Honda CR-V Forum. Your Hosts are steve_ & tidester
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I've been looking over a lot of posts here concerning the problem with the differential. Mine is an '07. From what I see, this is a design defect, though perhaps one that does not manifest itself on all CR-Vs. That makes it an interesting problem, for us and for Honda. BTW, I went through the BBB Lemon Law challenge with Honda two years ago over the torque steer in my '05 and won. When you win under Virginia's Lemon Law, the manufacturer must buy back the vehicle, as well as pay you for interest on loans. The manufacturer deducts a certain amount for your use of the vehicle. I think it's half the IRS mileage reimbursement rate.....AND...you pay only for those miles up to the point of your first complaint. My first complaint to the dealer about torque steer was about 20,000 miles and lots of dealer visits before I won. So I didn't owe them very much. And I was getting my loan interest back. Instead of a cash buy back, I asked and Honda agreed to sell me an '07 at a bit of a discount. I love the '07. But sure enough I got the vibration/moan and the dealer changed the differential fluid and burnished its clutches at 17,430 miles. I can now feel it subtly returning, like Freddy Kruger or Jason, at 24,000 miles. I expect it to be much more noticeable in a few weeks. BUNK to those who say Honda missprinted the recommended mileage for changing the differential fluid. This is a differential, for pete's sake, not an engine. They are supposed to go for a long time between changes. LONG time. That's why Honda recommends 60,000 and 90,000 miles depending on driving conditions. After learning here that some differentials have locked up at high speed, obviously a very dangerous situation, I intend to indicate to Honda and the dealer that I'm very concerned about this and believe the differential needs to be replaced. When I went to arbitration over the torque steer a couple of years ago I was very careful not to cast it as a design defect. That isn't covered in the BBB Lemon Law program because design defects show up in lots and lots of cars and Lemons are supposedly somewhat unique. Honda's rep argued at arbitration that there was no torque steer problem in the '05, which actually helped me. To the arbitrator it meant this was not a design flaw. Then when I floored it from a stoplight in D.C. and the arbitrator grabbed the arm rest as the car accelerated out of the lane and toward the curb, I figured I might win. Apparently Honda denies a design defect causes the differential problem. Fine. Looks like I got another Lemon......one that can be fixed with a new differential. And there's another twist. When I ordered the car loaded with everything.....navigation etc.....I specifically did not request AWD because I wanted slightly better mileage and we don't get much snow here. But it came with AWD anyway, no extra charge, probably because NOBODY orders one with everything BUT AWD and it would have been more trouble for them......sort of like asking McDonalds for a hamburger without mustard....it knocks them off stride. By the way, I saw somewhere that Honda touted a curious change in the '07. They redesigned the front suspension, they said, to eliminate torque steer........even though there never really was a problem.
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terryp1 writes: And there's another twist That is good writing re the Lemon Law I’m thrilled for you as far as winning in VA over the torque steer issue. Even though my 06 CRV had the rear diff issue at 25K (I have 60 k now and I’ve changed the rear diff twice, I see too many Vs of all generations on the road to think the problem is systemic but of course who knows if they’re AWD. As a Honda owner since 1977, I am surprised at this issue but so far no one’s been able to pin this as a recall kind of “Design Flaw Issue” Hunt around the rear diff posts and look for TSB regarding this, I would but I’m outta here for a while Later (here it is http://www.in.honda.com/Rjanisis/pubs/SB/A07-024.PDF
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Replying to: tedtcb (Apr 14, 2009 2:40 pm) I have the TSB. But it calls only for a fluid change and clutch burnishing. If I now need another such fluid change after just 6,000 or 7,000 miles since the first one, with the expensive expectation of more of the same until the car and I do part, then I need a new and improved differential. That is my belief. And that will be my stance with Honda and the dealer. |
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Replying to: tedtcb (Apr 14, 2009 2:40 pm) Thanks again for your insightful post! Keep us posted on any changes. |
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Replying to: terryp1 (Apr 14, 2009 1:59 pm) May I suggest studying the differences between a Honda RT4WD Differential and JUST a differential. It is like using any stereotype about people. Sounds plain un-smart and un-educated. |
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Replying to: blueiedgod (Apr 17, 2009 11:54 am) No questions asked and Honda service manager was very professional and went out of his way to make me happy. Obviously HONDA knows that their rear differentials have issues. I was totally impressed with HONDA service manager. By the way I have an Engineering degree with an MBA and do know something about cars.
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Replying to: blueiedgod (Apr 17, 2009 11:54 am) I have a hard time equating people with differentials.  tidester, host SUVs and Smart Shopper |
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Replying to: cdamech (Apr 18, 2009 2:49 am) No questions asked and Honda service manager was very professional and went out of his way to make me happy. Obviously HONDA knows that their rear differentials have issues. I was totally impressed with HONDA service manager. By the way I have an Engineering degree with an MBA and do know something about cars. Then the engineering degree should have suggested that the problem is with the fluid breaking down, not differential. By subtracting equations: Same differential, old fluid = does not work Same differential, new fluid = works ----------------------------------------------------------------- Old Fluid = does not work. Do Hondas in Canada come with longer powertrain warranty than the bumper to bumper warranty? The ones in the US come with 3 year/36,000 mile bumper to bumper, and 5 years/60,000 mile powertrain warranty. Not sure if the 5% increase was due to law suit settled in the US over the odometer inaccuracy.
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Replying to: blueiedgod (Apr 17, 2009 11:54 am) If it happens that they've produced a differential that needs its oil changed and its clutch plates burnished every 7,000 miles or so, they screwed up. (And I expect they know it.) They seem to believe the engine needs oil changes every 10,000 miles. And of course a differential would be expected to go much longer between changes, even one named R2-D2 or whatever.
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Replying to: terryp1 (Jun 02, 2009 10:02 am) If it happens that they've produced a differential that needs its oil changed and its clutch plates burnished every 7,000 miles or so, they screwed up. (And I expect they know it.) They seem to believe the engine needs oil changes every 10,000 miles. And of course a differential would be expected to go much longer between changes, even one named R2-D2 or whatever. Two words: Marketing and Accountants. When you have engineers design a very good product and then hand it off to Marketing and Accountants, they are bound to mess it up. I have Owner's manuals for the 83 Magna and 88 Prelude, and Honda sent sticky pages to paste over the ones in the book. But, with the addition of Lawyers to the corporate staff, they won't do it, because it would be equivalent to admission of guilt. So, now it is 3 words; Marketing, Accountants, and Lawyers.
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