Last post on Apr 25, 2013 at 10:23 AM
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Toyota Tacoma, Toyota 4Runner, Car Safety, Auto Body, Car Warranties, Truck
#683 of 1348 Crazy to put new frames in old trucks
Jan 31, 2009 (1:30 pm)
I would like to say this forum was very helpful for me and this is obviously a huge problem for toyota.. By reading this forum and gathering information it was at least fun to get service writers back peddling. What a friggin nightmare I have a 01 tacoma and to me toytota is nuts to put a new frame in vehicles worth about six grand.My truck was rear ended and needs 2 grand worth of work and I told the body shop to hold off,since I can drive it and wait to see what my frame status is..He told me the frame was changed in 01 and that explains the 98 to 2000 buy back they can't get them as someone posted. The retail price of a frame I was told is 3 grand,to me it would make sense for toyota to make some kind of offer to owners,if they would buy a new truck. I am also waiting for my letter and a call back from the dealer for a appointment.The frame warranty I believe he said is for fifteen years and the 01 to 04 trucks have just been added as a potential problem,last month I was told the 01 is fine. .Oh and that this is not a recall I guess just a huge blunder.Living in new jersey I feel it's not a question of if the frame will rust out it's just how soon. No wonder the beds are now made of plastic they probably would make the whole truck out of plastic if they could.
#684 of 1348 Re: Crazy to put new frames in old trucks [jokerman17]
Jan 31, 2009 (1:44 pm)
your 01 will rot out if its in or around new england.
it isnt a recall, im not sure how toyota got away with this not being a recall but they did. Maybe because they call it a "buy back" program and they "extend" the warranty on the frames.
In my experience, it didnt seem to matter if you were going to buy another toyota.
I had initially said that to the boston rep that came to look at my truck at the dealership and then when ISG called me with an offer I declined because I thought I should have got a little more. My case manager called me and basically said I was lucky and that this was a "good will" buy back.
As I mentioned before, he claims " we are not in the business of buying trucks back".
so that made my decision simple.
I wont ever give my money to toyota again.
As I said before, they act as if we are lucky they are even doing anything.
Also, think of this... Toyota had a 3rd party company manufacture these frames so you can only assume toyota is going after them as well so toyota will be compensated in some way so its not totally out of pocket for them.
#685 of 1348 Re: Crazy to put new frames in old trucks [jokerman17]
Jan 31, 2009 (2:00 pm)
You were right to hold off on the body shop work. If it's that bad they will cover it, if it's not covered now it will be. the "frame being changed in 01" sounds kind of fishy. so if it was, it shows the old one was bad and Toyota should replace it too.
My Tacoma was a 1999. I took it in for inspection in August, 2008.
I was told the program covered 1995-2000 Tacomas.
My Truck had enough rust that made it eligible for buyback.
But I didn't leave it at the dealer -even though one service guy tried to get me leave it - telling me it was a "safety" issue and it was dangerous. I told him I drove it to the dealer, I'm taking it and driving it while I wheel and deal with the Tacoma ISG Rep. They don't have any choice - it's your truck. You have the right to take it.
I FIRST drove it as much as I wanted;.
AFTER I settled with the Tacoma ISG rep, and he paid me, THEN I took Tacoma's loaner for 30 days. That way I took my time looking for a new vehicle.
How the extended 15 year warranty works:
My brother took in his 1998 at the same time I took in my 1999.
It didn't qualify for buyback - not enough rust. However, Dealer said Tacoma will extend, immediately the entire frame warranty for ALL TACOMAS, for
15 (fifteen) years from the date it was purchased new.
He bought his in December 98, so he can breing it back, once a year, until December 2013 and have it checked for rust, and if enough rust shows up on it, that is eligible for buyback. I don't see how they can't extend the warranty for 2001's, 2002's 2003's etc. if rust remains a problem.
I would sit and wait and drive it sparingly and try to drive something else old until it's resolved. I wouldn't spend $ 2,000 or $ 3,000 on it until I found out about Toyota covering it ean,ezn1o
#686 of 1348 Re: Crazy to put new frames in old trucks [mcalautt]
Jan 31, 2009 (2:45 pm)
Like I said you and others writing in this forum have been very informative and I thank you again. I really think the economy is playing into this problem maybe if toyota didn't decide to be kings of the big truck market and get into NASCAR at the worst time possible,they would have some cake for us. I really do believe at some point down the road they will figure this is nuts and make offers to us. I also think they have to look at this case by case. My 01 bare bones 4wd for example versus a loaded 04 has to come into play What about the bare bone 2wd trucks that are eight years old it just does not make sense. I am no mechanic but I know you built the vehicle around the frame and when most older vehicles get frame damage they are totaled. Could you imagine what this job would cost out of warranty at a buck twenty an hour and with a parts markup? They wanted 500 to install shocks I purchased. A point nobody is bringing up is how this effects the mechanics at toyota and the dealerships. They have to tie up A mechanics to do warranty frame work. Warranty work is always a loser for them as we speak toyota probably can't even put a exact time on this job. Along with those rusted frames are a lot of rusted bolts.They will have a lot of happy workers, lets see warranty frame job or cash brake job or tuneup. In my earlier post it was reputable body shop that told me they changed the frame in 01 ,the shop looked it up on the computer. I was all ready to get it fixed and then I came across this forum and told him to postpone the job till I get a answer. The sad part of this whole thing is the trucks on the outside look great. Back in the day the tacomas had all the rust problems with the wheel wells and beds. They fixed that and this time you can't notice the problem. A lot of people will get screwed,who buy them used and don't know of the problem. I cannot do that and will go down with the ship.Either they show me the money or it will be a old truck with a new frame. Maybe they made these frames out of the old rusted out trucks?
#687 of 1348 It gets better and better ...
Jan 31, 2009 (6:05 pm)
Well, Kevin is polite as a corporate drone can be. I know it's not his and Ms. Bishop's fault, so I do my best not to lose my mind when I deal with them, even though that's essentially what Toyota pays them for; to be the first in line for the firing squad as it were.
But, like you guys, I have no idea when the "kits" will be available, what my "kit" will include as all models will have different "kits" according to Kevin. When the dealership could expect my "kit" to arrive, or how long it would take once my "kit" got there. Sounds like they're building a model truck or something. He did mention leaf springs, but that's it, and even those he didn't seem too sure about.
I mentioned the absence of any formal acknowledgment from Toyota corp that there are frame rot issues with their Tacomas. The way I see it, regardless of how they're treating us who are aware we have a problem, the fact that they seem to be in no rush to let others know they might be putting themselves and their families in harm's way is frightening and disgusting. Is the corporate logic so far advanced that they will refuse to issue a recall and cross their fingers that noone is killed in a Tacoma due to frame failure while this little mess is being swept under the carpet by keeping us quiet by replacing our frames? It's downright scary when you think of it like that.
Kevin said that a formal letter was being sent out, but in "waves", that these mass mailings "take a lot of time" to get off the ground. Chalk that one up to bull, I've seen a backwoods secretary priority mail a thousand envelopes in under an hour. Don't tell me a corporate monster like Toyota can't do the same. Kevin told me even though I had opened a case that I would receive a letter. He even says it could take months, and that I could very well have my truck back from the dealership by the time the letter arrives. Gee, that makes me feel a lot better, and all the parents driving around with their kids in the back should do so in blissful ignorance and as long as it doesn't affect corporate earnings, right?!
All right ... off that soapbox for the moment and on to another one: A complete dissatisfaction with the NEW Toyotas.
I love my 2001. Takes a lickin' and keeps on tickin' ... until a serious frame issue pops up, but that's beside the point. I've been tooling around in a dealership provided 2008 Highlander until last Thursday. Kind of like a luxurious schoolbus ... handles about the same too. Anyway, the windshield wiper fluid light comes on. Pulled over, got a gallon and poured it in the resevoir ... and kept pouring. Turns out the resevoir is busted and fluid is pouring all over the concrete. Huh? Call the dealership and trade the Highlander rental for a 2009 Tacoma. By the time I get home, there is a message on my answering machine demanding a call back right away. The rental agent says the service department has looked at the Highlander and determined that I must have struck something as the interior bumper plates are pushed back and that's what crushed the windshield wiper fluid resevoir. Huh?! She said that the techs have seen it a lot this winter and I must have struck a snow bank. According to the techs the snowbanks are especially hard this year. WTF?! Long story short, I owe them $395 for damages incurred while in my possession, even though I think I'd remember if I smacked a snowbank, don't you? And that leads me to my initial rant about the new Toyotas. Are they that fragile that I might have crushed the front bumper supports and wiper fluid tank by simply parking the car into a snow bank? If I Dukes of Hazzarded it into the parking lot, I might understand, but the idea that a brand new vehicle can be messed right up with something I could probably inflict with my fist is really pathetic. So now I got this 2009 Tacoma and I'm scared to death to drive it in fear that it might suddenly incur some random damage I'll be held responsible for.
Uggghhh. Fixing up that old Ford truck out behind the garage is starting to look more and more inviting. Toyota has pissed in my shoes too many times in the last month.
#688 of 1348 Re: It gets better and better ... [Sambone5769]
Feb 01, 2009 (12:36 pm)
You got to lose the loaner and get something off a lease or off their used car lot.Four hundred for a plastic container and bumper brackets,this is what I been droning about all along. The cost on this frame job is insane for a outside body shop to just order a frame retail price is 3gs. Toyota isn't making and shipping these parts for nothing and like others have written you know they will make us eat something. You can hit 2 grand out of pocket in the blink of an eye. I really believe what happened is toyota thought the frame problem was just in the trucks before 01. They figured since they can' get them anymore and your dealing with ten year old vehicles, the answer was obvious a buyout. Than they realized recently 01 to 04 different frame,same problem, OH SHIT! I personally was told last month my 01 does not have this problem,made at a different plant yada yada yada. Maybe they will hit the trifecta and find 05 to the present is wrong,who can say. Toyota may have forgot how to rustproof frames but they are not totally stupid and know they have to think this out for the best possible solution.I think the truck value will come into play and if you are the original owner and who yells the loudest.Has anybody been to a dealership that has done this job? I'm still trying to just get mine on the lift still no call back for an appointment. Looking forward to "the letter" January has come and gone,still nothing by pony express. Really looking forward to phase two of this maybe tomorrow maybe next year. One thing for sure if they go thru with this your talking about a long line at the deli.
#689 of 1348 Re: It gets better and better ... [Sambone5769]
Feb 01, 2009 (12:55 pm)
This is the other reason I worked a trade-in deal with my dealer.
Having their rental is a liability, and can become an extra expense in this already nightmare-ish problem.
If you can and it's in the cards for you, get your dealer to take yours in trade kbb trade value (as if the frame problem did not exist) and then take it to buy an aggressively discounted new car from them.
You do sadly get a new payment, but you also get a new car, and the nightmare goes away. They also get a 'sale' at a time when they need them and Corp will pay for frame work (not the dealer).
It worked for me. Didn't want a payment, but more so didn't want the nightmare to last another 6 months... or longer.
Feb 01, 2009 (2:03 pm)
I am glad it worked out for you. What I would like to know did the dealer give you any kind of time frame if they were to fix it and were you allowed to leave with your truck. I am totally confused at what they are telling you guys.Old Bones is like it ain't no thing toyota is on it and everything will be great. Others are saying it is a total runaround. In a nutshell any advice would be greatly appreciated
#691 of 1348 Re: It gets better and better ... [doubleusn]
Feb 01, 2009 (2:05 pm)
I never considered the rental a liability till it hit me in the pocket personally, and I can't afford things like this right now. I really can't afford a new payment.
However, I think it might be in my best interests to take a spin around there used lot and see if there is something that might work as a trade. Even if they offered me top KBB for my Taco, that's not saying a whole lot since the value has plummeted recently.
I'd like to get a truck back. Not a TOY that breaks if it's sneezed on wrong. I use my truck, it's not just for looks.
#692 of 1348 Re: It gets better and better ... [Sambone5769]
Feb 01, 2009 (6:53 pm)
Sambone5769 your wrong.
why buy another toyota after this run around and blatant disregard for your safety.
I will never buy a toyota again and not because of the quality, shit happens,
but the way they are treating people sux.
further more, trade in your taco now for nothing, the dealership will get the frame paid for the same way and turn around and sell it for much more and tell the buyer " dont worry about the frame problem you heard of sir, this has a new frame with a 15 year warranty.."
DONT GIVE EM UR MONEY..
u want a truck ? buy a ridgeline.. look at consumer reports.. it got awesome accross the board