Last post on Aug 22, 2008 at 10:00 PM
You are in the Ford Taurus/Mercury Sable
What is this discussion about?
Ford Five Hundred, Ford Taurus, Mercury Sable, Future Vehicle, Sedan, Wagon
#462 of 530 Ford, Toyota, Honda
Nov 23, 2007 (10:14 am)
I love my 2002 Odyssey. I just put in a rebuild transmission at 180K kms (1st time); but the vehicle is soooo comfortable compared to anything I owned before and has that zip. My dealer does extras at 'no charge'.
Who said Honda & Toyota pay less than USA. No, they pay more to the factory floor, to keep their employees happy & keep them from going over to the BIG3; without a union.
My previous vehicle was a 1992 Taurus, long-stoke. Lasted 276K kms. But, had brake problems, rear fender rust, 3 wiper motors, 2 turn sign counsols, 2 door motors goine. I traded it when the power brakes disappeared.
A firend is looking to buy either a Prius or a 2008 Taurus. Will the Prius start in sub-aero winter weather for many times in the Canadian winter, parked outside. He currently has a 2000 Taurus SEL. Maybe I should tell hime to keep it as he has had no problems in 230K kms.
Tell me if I'm wrong, but isn't the Fusion & Edge based on the Mazda6?
The biggest seller in Canada is the Honda Civic. I don't know what the biggest seller is the USA, but I don't think it's the Fusion as someone montioned that works for a Ford dealer.
It's interesting that the Infinitis are great vehciles along with the Hondas but the Nissans don't do well even thoought Infiniti is really a Nissan with more accessories and power. Maybe the French Renault people who own Nissan have something to do with it.
#463 of 530 Re: Its the Look [gregg_vw]
Nov 23, 2007 (1:56 pm)
The Avalon is tall, but doesn't look nearly as ill-proportioned as the Taurus/500.
I guess beauty is in the eye of the beholder. The Avalon is about the last car in the world I would call stylish. It's WB is a couple of inches shorter than a Taurus and it is a couple of inches lower but it looks every bit as ungainly, if not more so, to my eye. The Charger has better overall proportions but it has a face that only a mother could love. I think the Buick Lucerne is about the best looking full-sized car. The Impala isn't bad, either. I loved the Chrysler 300 when it first was introduced but it has not aged that well.
Opinions of styling are like butts - everybody has one. In any case, I have already conceded that few will buy a Taurus based on it's striking beauty.
#464 of 530 Re: Its the Look [brucelinc]
Nov 23, 2007 (2:45 pm)
I wouldn't call the Avalon stylish either. My point was the Avalon doesn't look nearly as tippy and bulbous as the Taurus. Tall cars can be drawn any number of ways. The first generation Avalon was plain to awful looking, but sold on Toyota reputation and value for the money. The second was bigger, roomier and even more ungainly looking than the first. But it was roomy, pushing the sides almost upright to get every interior inch.
The current generation actually has some style by comparison, even if it isn't your cup of tea (it's not mine either). Anyway, in the opinion of the marketplace, it's not doing too badly. Of course Toyota has been able to sell frumpy cars. (Ford didn;t have the reputation to be able to do the same.) Thank God Toyota is now including some styling too! In another couple generations, you might actually like the Avalon.
#465 of 530 Re: Its the Look [gregg_vw]
Nov 24, 2007 (9:25 am)
A tall sedan does not have to look plain.
I suppose not. But what's wrong with plain? (After all, the Camry was pretty plain).
Nothing wrong with plain, IMO. In fact, I suspect it helps keep the car off the "got to steal" list, and thus insurance rates are kept lower on it.
#466 of 530 Re: Its the Look [barnstormer64]
Nov 24, 2007 (11:52 am)
OK, as I haven't posted in a while;
1) The current generation Camry looks about as bad as can be. It reminds me of a hot dog looking at the front end (the current generation Chrysler 300 and last GM vans, but especially the Pontiac Montana SV6, also).
2) I would not by any means say I love it, but the look of the Taurus looks nice, like a dubbed-up Lincoln Town Car or something.
3) I was waiting for an appointment today when I looked down and saw my own 2001 Taurus. In gold, the lines were still looking like I bought it yesterday, but it is eight years old (November 2000). I saw a gold Five Hundred and a gold Montego side-by-side today. Both looked aged, and gold is one of the better colors for aging.
4) The Five Hundred was a good if not great car in all aspects (except engine performance, which was its main fault). I was impressed by the interior spacde and comfort of the cloth seats. I felt as if the components would hold up well.
5) Being the 'fat girl' in the school isn't necessarily a bad thing. They tend to be more understanding of others, like the Taurus. The Taurus was designed well inside and out, in my opinion, unlike the Camry and the Accord.
6) The fact that the 2008 Taurus has all-wheel-drive might knock the Legacy/Outback off their pedestals. For the record, both the Legacy and Outback are only midsized, but still compare due to their 'luxury' and all-wheel-drive. Additionally, the Legacy was the quote-on-quote 'sportier' one and was closer to the ground. The Outback was more 'rugged' quote-on-quote. It was higher off the ground, being more suitable for off-roading, even though, with either choice, I'd rent a Jeep. For 2008, Subaru has made the Legacy sedan-only, and the Outback wagon-only.
7) In 2005, when the Five Hundred went on sale, Ford's idea was for it to be the company flagship (luxury car), not to replace the Crown Victoria. The Crown Victoria was still the full-size.
8) I read somewhere that out of 100 New York Taxicabs, 92 or 93 of them are Ford Crown Victorias. Another 2-3 out of the 100 are Toyota Sienna minivans, another 1-2 are Chevrolet Impalas, and another 1-2 are Ford Escape Hybrids. The rest are something else.
9) Ford Crown Victorias are approximately 99.7% bulltproof. I realize that the Five Hundred/Taurus and Montego/Sable are rated the safest full-size cars on the market, but they are not proven like the Crown Victoria.
10) Out of every 100 ambulances, 96 of them are mounted on a Ford E-Series chassis. This means that if you had to be rushed to a hospital via ambulance, you have a 96% chance of being taken there by a Ford Ford's doing something right, with the numbers of taxis and ambulances that are Fords. Not to mention the Super Duty superiority.
11) In my opinion, Ford should redesign the Crown Victoria, keep it as a full-size sedan for large families and travelers police cars and taxis, keep the Taurus for something to compete against the Subaru Legacy/ Outback and for smaller familes, the Fusion for, say, college people, and the Focus for the fuel-conscious and sporty. May as well redesign the Ranger while they're at it and make a 'SuperCrew' or 'Double Cab' or something with doors like a sedan. The nameplate is familiar, being around for a such a long time.
12) Happy Thanksgiving!
#467 of 530 Re: Its the Look [jmn1]
Nov 24, 2007 (12:50 pm)
The Taurus looks like a dubbed up Lincoln Town Car? On which planet?
Yes, everyone has an opinion. This is the first time I have seen the Legacy (a compact) compared with a Taurus (behemoth). First time I've seen the new Focus called "sporty," first time I've seen the Fusion family sedan described as college kid material. Ford obviously makes some good products (trucks, Mustang, etc.), but say goodby the Crown Vic and Ranger.
The current generation Camry has style, swoops, curves and lines that previous Camrys never had. It is either love it or hate it, whereas the previous generation was more like the 500...just there. Toyota is moving toward a look many people don't like, but a lot do. It is defining the brand, something Ford needs to do. How they ever thought the grill on the new Focus bears any resemblance to the Fusion or Taurus or Edge is beyond me.
Now the 09 F150 grill looks like a previous generation Tundra. So they have the Superduty grill, the F150 grill, the Expedition grill which is yet a whole other theme, the three bar grill, the two bar grill, the Mustang grill, the Escape grill. Despite Ford going for a more unified look, the more they seem to come up with differnent looks. Reminds me of the many current Lincoln grills (MKX. MKZ, Navi, Mark LT, Town Car). What is a Lincoln supposed to look like? Remeber when Fords really looked like Fords?
#468 of 530 Re: Its the Look [jmn1]
Nov 24, 2007 (7:50 pm)
The problem with the Crown Vic is that it drives like a boat. Not so, the Five Hundred (err, new Taurus)
#469 of 530 Where's the marketing?
Nov 26, 2007 (8:00 am)
Last spring, when we first heard that the 500 was going to be improved and be called "Taurus," I applauded the idea of the name change because of it's familiarity. I mistakenly assumed that Ford would make a huge marketing splash to re-introduce the "new" Taurus and promote all of it's great features. Instead, we have had a couple of lame ads and some big rebates.
Like anyone with a new car, my wife and I have been showing ours to our friends and family. It is obvious to me that NO ONE KNOWS THIS CAR EXISTS! Tons of comments like: "Is THAT a Taurus?" "That doesn't look like a Taurus." "I didn't know that was a Taurus." "Do they still make the Taurus?"
We took some friends out to dinner this weekend and they rode in the back seat. HUSBAND: "WOW, this is like riding in a limosine!" WIFE: This car is so quiet and smooth, it doesn't even feel like we are moving." They currently drive a Pontiac Bonneville and I think I could have sold them a Taurus on the spot!
My point is, why the H*LL is Ford keeping this car a secret? Most of us agree that the styling is not gonna sell it so why don't they promote its real virtues?
#470 of 530 Re: Let's compare markets.
Nov 26, 2007 (1:21 pm)
Ok, but it has the same lines as a Town Car and the chrome (I think...).
Also, I choose to clarify something. By the term Super Duty Superiority, it has been the best-selling truck for the last, what, 30 years? I also read somewhere that the F-150 outsells the Tundra by about 8 to 1. It also outsells the Ridgeline by about 13 to 1 (I don't remember where I read this).
As for the Ranger, I'm telling you (Ford), KEEP THE NAME THIS TIME, redesign the truck, get rid of the two-door Supercab, and add a four-door. That's it. If I were designing a car for production, I would look at that market for a few years, take all of the good features, put them in, take the bad, improve them, and make one innovation.
Only time will tell what Ford will do. Let's take for example, the outdated Ford Freestar. I thought it was a DECENT minivan, but it lacked (in my opinion) two major features. Those were 2nd-row power windows and a split-folding third row. Moving a kid in college and only having one who does sports (soccer), the one-piece is livable. But, at least as an upgrade, a split should be forseen. As for the windows, that alone could steer me toward the Hyundai Entourage or almost new Toyota Sienna or Honda Odyssey. That alone WOULD DEFINITELY keep me from buying it, unless it has a rebate that made it only, $12000. I saw a loaded SEL 4.2L V6 (2006) with 21000 miles on it, for $14K.
I still think the Taurus is good, but the Freestyle only needed a better engine. At least it was fuel efficient. Why Taurus X? How about... oh, forget it. May as well call it Tempo or Escort. I mean, Ford Taurus X Limited SEL AWD has NO RING to it.
#471 of 530 Re: Where's the marketing? [brucelinc]
Nov 27, 2007 (8:57 am)
Bruce - I hope you're enjoying your Taurus. Sounds like you are. They are definitely competent vehicles for the money.
As for nobody knows about em - you're right about that. Our friend autoextremist said not long ago that GMs marketing dept was going to take Ford to school on how to introduce a new car with it's efforts for the new Malibu. It looks to me right now that he was right again. Has anyone NOT seen the ads for the 'car you can't ignore'? And the Malibu reviews are calling it 'better than GM says it is'. I've always been a Ford man, but that was because there was always reason to be. GM seems to really have it's act together now. We'll see when the data comes in. Ford doing well with reliability right now at least with the Mexican-made cars.