Last post on May 17, 2013 at 1:14 PM
You are in the SUVs
What is this discussion about?
GMC Acadia, Hyundai Santa Fe, Ford Taurus X, Toyota RAV4, Nissan Rogue, Honda Accord Crosstour, Dodge Journey, Car Buying, Car Comparisons, SUV
#5340 of 7326 Re: TX and other CUV's [vad1819]
Jan 28, 2008 (11:30 am)
About Flex: the interior looks same as TX. The second row moves same as TX, even seat same.The space behind third row looks same as TX.
I see where you're coming from now. The seats, floor and some other smaller details are very similar. I thought you were talking about the dash and other more obvious things like the insides of the doors, because they are very different.
It makes a lot of sense that there would be some similarites as they are both built on the same modified Volvo platform (XC90, S80, XC70). Since Mulally let the cat out of the bag regarding the all new from the ground up 2009 Taurus, and the recent intro of the Explorer America, the Ford forums have been very active regarding the future of the TX. So far it doesn't look good for the TX. Word is the Explorer America concept will be a production model come 2009, the Flex will be for sale and the new Taurus will be going on sale too. All of them will use the same Volvo platform with the Explorer and Flex basically being the replacements for the TX.
In that sense you can almost say that the Flex will be the all new TX.
#5341 of 7326 Re: Outlander? [ateixeira]
Jan 28, 2008 (11:31 am)
2009 Forester styling looks refreshing and actually reminds me the Outlander. We have a large Chicago Auto Show coming just in 10 days, so I’ll check it out.
#5342 of 7326 Re: TX and other CUV's [baggs32]
Jan 28, 2008 (12:22 pm)
I knew I missed something. I rushed through the upstairs of the DC Auto Show and forgot to check if they had a Flex on the floor.
That's too big for our current purchase, but I'm curious to see that interior.
Bummer. I should go on the first day, and then go a 2nd time to catch what I missed.
#5343 of 7326 Re: Crossover Comparison continued [chelentano]
Jan 28, 2008 (12:26 pm)
Car magazines get 99% of revenue from advertising and marketing all paid my manufactures, so by nature these magazines are sales and marketing tools for manufacturers
I just flipped through a recent copy of C&D. There were 52 ads placed by non auto manufacturers and 13 placed by the auto manufacturers. I don't see how "99%" of their revenue is generated by 20% of their ad space. That makes no sence. Once again, do you have proof that their assessments of vehicles is asque and based on monies that various auto manufacturers give them? Such as Toyota and Honda gaining praise over Mitsu because Honda and Toyota advertise more with that magazine? BTY, the issue of C&D I flipped through was March 07, and there was one Toyota, one Honda and one Mitsu ad, all were full page. I think it is safe to say, they all cost the same.
Then be consistent: you should not count personal opinions of magazine “experts”, nor your own personal opinions
I think you misunderstood me. You personal opinion that magazines' opinions of vehicles are bias due to revenue generated by advertisement does not count. Not your actual opinion of the vehicle.
Best product does not always have biggest market share (Microsoft/Apple, betamax/VHS, etc.)
Point well made. Cannot disagree with you there. I am a loyal Apple computer owner.
#5344 of 7326 Re: TX and over CUV's [baggs32]
Jan 28, 2008 (12:28 pm)
and I think you're with me on this, so why split the hairs for an inch or two of legroom?
I am with you. The only way you can definitively say that something is comfortable and fits your needs is to do what I do. Climb in the back of a car and plop your behind in the seat while somebody else drives the car around. Our salesman looked at me funny because when my wife was doing the test-drive I headed straight to the 3rd row to sit. If the comfort in the least comfortable spot is good, then ther rest will be good.
Then again, when my dad and I took my sister to college one year I had to spend 5 hours in one of those little folding seats behind the passenger seat in a S-10 pickup with a 10 gallon fishtank full of CDs on my lap. I did not complain, much. Many people have said that my threshold for pain and suffering is abnormally high.
#5345 of 7326 Re: Outlander? [ateixeira]
Jan 28, 2008 (7:57 pm)
The outgoing Forester was smaller, the 09 is bigger and has a lot more features. NAV, back-up cams, Sportshift controls, Siruis. On the 234hp turbo, premium is recommended but technically not required. The higher-boost version of the same engine in the Legacy actually requires premium.
This is nitpicky, but have you actually seen anything to verify this? I know at one time (2004-2005) premium for the FXT was only "recommended", but the manual & gas cap list it as "required" starting in MY06 (the year I bought mine) and AFAIK it has not changed since.
And it's got 224 horses, not 234.
But more important than anything... starting in 2010 in the U.S. the Forester will be offered with the new 2.0L boxer diesel, a powerplant which is currently getting absolutely rave reviews from Europe. How many other crossovers sold stateside will be able to boast a new, clean diesel in the next two years?
#5346 of 7326 Re: Crossover Comparison continued [chuckhoy]
Jan 28, 2008 (9:48 pm)
I understand what you went through with your wife. I figured it would be a problem for me too. They like style. We like substance. That's why I was trying to hold off from driving the Lexus lookalikes, so that she would drive the other vehicles first, without prejudice. I really wanted her to try the Acadia, but they were parked right beside the Enclaves, and once she saw the Enclave, it was all over. I'm afraid the blinders are on now.
By the way, I would have gladly tried an Outlook if we had a Saturn dealer near us, but we don't.
I hope that you and your wife are enjoying the Outlook. I imagine that it is a great vehicle, if it is anything like the Enclave that we drove.
#5347 of 7326 Re: Crossover Comparison continued [hoser0eh]
Jan 28, 2008 (10:27 pm)
if you bought a saturn, I'm sure your local buick dealer would be happy to take your money to do the service/warranty work on it locally like my local lincoln dealer does on my ford. it actually is a nice way to go as customer service will quite possibly be nicer being the "upscale" brand.
save the money on the buy-in and reap the advantages of local service that might be better than you would have received otherwise.
just a thought... and good luck
#5348 of 7326 Re: Crossover Comparison continued [aviboy97]
Jan 28, 2008 (10:30 pm)
>> I just flipped through a recent copy of C&D. There were 52 ads placed by non auto manufacturers and 13 placed by the auto manufacturers. I don't see how "99%" of their revenue is generated by 20% of their ad space. That makes no sence. Once again, do you have proof that their assessments of vehicles is asque and based on monies that various auto manufacturers give them? Such as Toyota and Honda gaining praise over Mitsu because Honda and Toyota advertise more with that magazine? BTY, the issue of C&D I flipped through was March 07, and there was one Toyota, one Honda and one Mitsu ad, all were full page. I think it is safe to say, they all cost the same.
This site where you’ve read that comparo for instance is almost 100% car advertising. I looked through the Automobile mag and yes, in fact more then 50% automotive ads are by non auto manufacturers (not quite 80% though), which are tires, stereo, even a diamond ring. But we also don’t know how much a manufacturer pays to a magazine to do a car review, which is in addition to regular ads.
Regardless of the other advertised goods, these are still a car magazines, which issue “Car of the year” awards or publish car comparison ratings. They don’t rate tires nor they say that Bose is better then Harman Kardon, which is better then Pioneer. So basically this is a car magazine, which issues car ratings and it gets substantial revenue from car manufacturers. Enough said, it’s a marketing magazine.
Imagine, that judge and jury in a court room are paid directly by one or both sides of the law suite. Would you really need any proof in addition to some common sense, that this can not be a fair trial???
#5349 of 7326 Re: Crossover Comparison continued [aviboy97]
Jan 28, 2008 (10:32 pm)
>> I think you misunderstood me. You personal opinion that magazines' opinions of vehicles are bias due to revenue generated by advertisement does not count. Not your actual opinion of the vehicle.
No you misunderstood: According to your own logic, your personal opinion that magazines' opinions of vehicles are not bias due to revenue generated by advertisement does not count (unless you have a proof). If you want to be consistent, personal opinion of “experts” should not count either, uless they have a "proof".
Also we don’t know qualifications of these “experts”. I am more interested in ratings here on edmunds.com by real-world owners. Real-world owners don't market or sell cars, but instead they buy them paying hard earned dollars. I have more trust to a 100 of real people who bought a car and drive it for a few months, rather then to one magazine “expert”, who drives a brand new car from dealership just for an hour and who is paid by advertising dollars.