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Sedans Acura TSX 04 Acura TSX vs Certified 04 BMW 325i vs 04 Saab 9-3 Aero
34 messages, Last post on Apr 20, 2007 at 8:45 AM
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I've been reading through the forums today and think this is a better place than most other car forums for asking this question. It seems like most people have an intelligent opinion on here rather than being more concerned about tricking out their cars. Over the past month or so, I've been researching cars... learning more about them, narrowing down, adding more to the list, and repeating. I currently have an '03 Mitsu Eclipse GTS. I bought it new in August of '02 and it currently has 83,000 miles on it. Found out recently that we'll be expecting our first child in August, so looking to trade up to a 4 door. Would like something that has a little luxury and that's a little fun to drive as well. Already eliminated 1. '04 Infiniti G35- For every one that I see that I like, there are 5 that just don't appeal to me. 2. '04 Audi 3.0 A4- Don't like the ugly gray color trim on the bottom, looks too much like a Passat to me, and would have to drive at least 150 miles roundtrip to even test drive one (all 1.8T's around dealers here) 3. '04 Lexus IS300- Too much for too little, and after seeing the new IS line, it makes these look ancient. So, I've pretty much narrowed it down to a Certified '04 BMW 325i with 30k miles, '04 Acura TSX w/nav 20k miles, and an '04 Saab 9-3 Aero with 20k miles. Only the BMW is certified. Living in Wisconsin, so will probably have to put up with a few snowstorms a year. The RWD of the BMW concerns me a little, but I'm sure it wouldn't be a huge issue. The I4 of the Acura concerns me because I was orignally looking at all 6 cylinders. The Saab concerns me simply because it's interior seems pretty drab and I'm not sure how often mechanics around here deal with Saabs (one Saab dealer here in town and it's a hut with like 4 cars), plus I think I've read of some electrical problems on this board. Word of mouth scared me on the BMW because of it's supposed reliability issues and cost of maintence/repair. BMW offers an additional warranty on top of their extended certified warranty for around $1300 that would extend my 50k warranty to 100k, only a $50 deductible would apply. However, after looking at Edmunds and other sites, it seems like repair and maintanence costs on the TSX and 325i are pretty comparable. Strange because most polls show Asian cars as significantly more reliable, and sometimes show American cars as more reliable than German cars. My wife leans toward the Bimmer simply so she can have the BMW plate and tell people she's putting our child's car seat in a Bimmer. I think I'm leaning towards the Acura because I still think it's more reliable through word of mouth, even though numbers don't seem to back that up. The Saab is kinda in the same category as the Audi (have to drive a bit just to get a test drive in), but I really like the look of the Aero (and it can be had for a bit cheaper than the Acura and BMW). Price on the Acura and BMW would be pretty similar because of the mileage difference. Saab would be a bit cheaper. I've rattled on for long enough, so if anybody has any more insight, it would be greatly appreciated. I know there are similar threads, but those seem more geared to '06 models. Thanks in advance!
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Replying to: drolly (Jan 24, 2007 5:42 pm) If you're interested in fun-to-drive and are looking at manuals, I say the TSX and BMW are a wash. The BMW will have a slight performance edge, but the Acura will likely have the edge in reliability. Drive each one and go with your priorities. If you are looking at automatics, the performance gap between the BMW and Acura widens significantly. The TSX loses a good amount of it's sporty, fun-to-drive character when saddled with a slushbox - the BMW not so much. Of course, many people I know swear by their auto tranny TSX's so you definitely need to drive them both and decide for yourself. Stay away from the Saab. There's a reason why it's so inexpensive. Unless you really like it and need to save a few bucks, the other two are far better choices - in my opinion.
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Replying to: fedlawman (Jan 24, 2007 6:15 pm)  Automatics trans on all.
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Replying to: drolly (Jan 24, 2007 6:21 pm) |
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Replying to: drolly (Jan 24, 2007 5:42 pm) If this BMW is truly a Certified Pre-Owned (CPO) car, then it should already have warranty coverage to 6yr/100K miles. The standard warranty provides bumper-to-bumper coverage for 4yr/50K, and the CPO warranty provides additional coverage up to 6yr/100K, with a $50 deductible per visit. The CPO warranty is not a full bumper-to-bumper warranty, but it seems to cover most of the expensive components and electronics. Hence, I'm not quite sure what you were offered for around $1300?  I'm guessing this was either an offer to improve the CPO warranty into a full bumper-to-bumper coverage plan, or this was an offer to purchase an extended service plan to increase the no-cost maintenance up to 100K miles. Either way, if you decide not to pay this $1300, you will still have significant warranty coverage on that BMW for up to 6yr/100K. Once the no-cost maintenance expires on the BMW, some of the maintenance costs will be more expensive on the BMW than the Acura, especially if performed at the dealer. A brake service, or the 60K service (Inspection II), are expensive on a BMW. Because of that, I plan to buy the extended service contract for my BMW. Around here, I can purchase it for $1195. Chances are a typical Acura model will be more reliable than a BMW. However, keep in mind that 2004 was the very first model year for the TSX in America. First-year models typically have more reliability issues. However, because the TSX is based on the European Accord, this may not matter. The key point in this discussion is you will have a longer warranty with the BMW, if the TSX is not certified. I would be careful about the Saab 9-3. Whereas the '03 and newer BMW 3-series had fairly average reliability ratings (good enough to be recommended by Consumer Reports, for instance), in contrast, the 9-3 exhibited much worse than average reliability in recent years, based on the info I've seen. About 4 years ago I had some interest in a 9-3. With apologies to the Saab fans, I personally would never purchase one now. Before you decide, I would recommend taking one additional test drive and a closer look at both cars. Also, ask the dealer if they can pull up the service/repair history on each car. Two other points: 1) Another upscale sporty sedan to consider, especially for your region of the country, might be a Volvo S60. There should be big incentives -- if not now, then a little later this year. The S60, with the premium package, arguably provides a little more luxury, but the handling won't be as sporty as the BMW or TSX. 2) Congratulations! I assume this car will not be the primary "family" vehicle? I previously made the mistake of thinking a mid-sized sedan could serve as the primary transportation for my wife and toddler. It was fine for trips to the park or shopping malls, but it did not provide enough cargo space for vacations trips. Toddlers require lots of equipment and supplies when taking vacations! 
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Replying to: drolly (Jan 24, 2007 5:42 pm)
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Replying to: saablcp (Jan 25, 2007 10:48 am) |
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Replying to: cotmc (Jan 24, 2007 10:21 pm) Hence, I'm not quite sure what you were offered for around $1300? I'm guessing this was either an offer to improve the CPO warranty into a full bumper-to-bumper coverage plan, or this was an offer to purchase an extended service plan to increase the no-cost maintenance up to 100K miles. Either way, if you decide not to pay this $1300, you will still have significant warranty coverage on that BMW for up to 6yr/100K. Yes, that is what was offered to me. I think it was around $1200-1300, and it did something like that. I think there was a $50 deductible involved, but I may be mistaking that with the CPO warranty. I have test driven both cars already, albeit about a month apart. I'm hoping to either go tonight or Monday night to test drive both the Acura and BMW one after the other. After first test drive, I think the BMW drove better than the Acura, but the interior of the Acura blew the BMW away. BMW seems more geared to driving than "living" and unfortunately, I do a fair amount of "living" in my car. Not to drive a point into the ground, but you have no concerns about a RWD car in Wisconsin winter? Actually, I'll just do this. Based on more research and feedback on this thread, I've pretty much eliminated the Saab. So, pro's and con's of the remaining 2. BMW Pros: Nameplate/prestige, warranty, RWD (I'll throw it in both since a lot of people swear by RWD), renowned driving experience/ride, full size spare tire, heated seats, drive and passenger power seats Cons: RWD in WI, reliability reputation (friend has a Benz that he's had to replace the water pump twice in 3 years), cost based on reliability reputation, simple interior Acura Pros: Xenon headlights, heated seats, Nav system, FWD (some may consider it a pro in WI), cool-looking intrument panel, CD changer (currently have a 6-disc in my Eclipse, really like the changer), reliability reputation Cons: 4 cylinder, seats feel a bit cheaper, no power seat for passenger, warranty (or lack thereof), first model year in US Anything else that I'm missing or should/shouldn't be worried about? Oh, and I considered a Volvo, but just don't like the way they look. Forgot to throw that in the eliminated category in the first post.
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Replying to: drolly (Jan 25, 2007 1:08 pm) Does the BMW have the Sports Package with 17" rims and performance tires, or does it have the standard 16" all-season tires? The latter could provide reasonable traction in snow. The low-profile performance tires provided with the Sports Package won't. Regarding your friend's Benz, well, I must admit I take stock with the general reliability data provided in Consumer Reports. For the past few years, they have shown several Benz models having poor reliability. I've also seen reports in different forums of unhappy Benz owners, as well as my neighbor who traded in his Benz after less than two years with it. In fact, the 2007 New Car Preview edition does not recommend any new Benz model. That doesn't necessarily mean they are bad cars, but many of their models tend to require more visits to the dealer. Although European cars, in general, have lower reliability, we shouldn't lump them all into the same category. For instance, the 04-06 CR data indicates the Volvo S60 was slightly more reliable than the Infiniti G35 or the new 2006 Lexus IS350. The 2006 BMW 3-series was rated just slightly above average reliability, while the 2006 Lexus GS350 was just slightly below average. Hence, some European models compete reaonably well... some don't. I looked up CR's reliability data for an '04 TSX, and it looks quite good. The one glaring problem area was the audio (stereo) system. All other systems looked good.
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Replying to: drolly (Jan 24, 2007 5:42 pm) If you go with the BMW, plan on getting a set of dedicated snow tires for the winter, preferably mounted on their own set of wheels. Either the Bimmer or Acura should do you well. Good luck.
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