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Smart Shopper Comments: Consumer Reports/JD Power Rankings
674 messages, Last post on Sep 13, 2009 at 2:37 PM
You are in the Smart Shopper Forum. Your Hosts are kirstie_h & tidester
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Consumer reports uses a time test method of polling thousands of owners of current and older models. JD Power uses data from the first '90 days. Furthermore Consumer Reports is a not for profit while JD Power gets the majority of revenue from corporations. I think that pretty much speaks for itself, but I'm sure GM lovers will find reasons to fault Consumer Reports.
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Replying to: dbostondriver (Mar 20, 2009 12:51 pm) CR has had nice things to say about GM recently. It recommends the Malibu, Vibe, Aura, Lucerne, DTS, Avalanche (rated #1 in its class), Silverado, and Sierra. It rates the CTS, STS, Corvette, Cobalt SS, Traverse, Acadia, Outlook, Enclave, Suburban, and Yukon highly in their classes but doesn't recommend them either because of insufficient reliability data or below-average reliability based on their survey. Lots there for GM lovers to like. 
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Replying to: dbostondriver (Mar 20, 2009 12:51 pm) The accusatory tone against all owners of a brand of car is NOT appreciated. I hope the hosts remove this post. If someone wants to play brand games I'm sure we can find more than enough to discuss.
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Not only have I always been right, but I've been absolutely 100% right. JD Powers is worthless junk on par with the value of AIG insurance without the bailout money backing it (which is probably a negative value, not even zero). JD Powers is further corrupted and biased by being nothing more than a marketing advertising ploy paid for by the corporations that are willing to pay for good reviews. JD Powers doesn't measure long term reliability, but only advertises paid-for commercially managed and directed initial and short term quality responses to "configured and set-up" questions. Basically, it's all scripted. Now CR on the other hand is of scientific and mathetmatical value, with no advertising or marketing tendencies. It is simply a factual database of records on existing vehicles. CR has always shown the true real unfiltered raw data of what is really going on in the marketplace. CR has never waivered from being the "BIBLE" of authenticity and objective review. They have always been above reproach for ethics, honor, honesty, and accountability. They have always been "straight" with the American public. JD Powers is a joke. JD Powers is the equivalent of Ford's commercials were they set people up to drive multiple vehicles and then testify (not under oath) to the superiority of the Fords. Does anyone ever wonder what would stop Ford from sabotaging the Accords and Camry's being compared with the Fusions? They have a financial incentive to do so; so it makes sense they would do so when they run the show and make the rules. Since CR doesn't profit from labeling one car bad and another spectacular, they have no motive to rig the vehicles. JD Powers has motive to rig their data, their results, and their testing procedures.
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Replying to: andres3 (Mar 20, 2009 2:20 pm) Perhaps, but only to the extent that the sample frame and the target population coincide, i.e. their surveys only include subscribers who choose to respond. tidester, host SUVs and Smart Shopper
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Replying to: tidester (Mar 20, 2009 4:33 pm) CR does not verify that people returning questionaires are the subscriber. CR does not balance the reporting of information among vehicle brands and models. It can't. The election to report information is solely made by the subscriber if they have a motivation, good or evil, about their vehicle. CR subscriber base is not reported so that the demographics are known. Many people read it, but do so at the library or online through my library as do I when I want to check their opinion on something (other than cars). The idea that there is scientific methodology and mathematical value to the CR information in the final form in which they slush it through to the consumer is ludicrous. The raw data contains some information, but as CR has admitted the difference between their circle values is small, whereas in the past it was larger. The equivalent level of information could be obtained by convenience polling at the entrance to randomly chosen Krogers on randomly chosen days around the country and asking people, if they wish to, to take a poll about their car. A similar level of information would be obtained--useful, interesting if interpreted by knowledgeable statistician, but not rocket science.
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Replying to: imidazol97 (Mar 20, 2009 5:20 pm) 
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CR also is not noncommercial. They are always trying to sell their reports to local radio and TV outlets. They are making money just like other businesses. They are selling magazines. If they don't give the kinds of reports their group of readers expect, expect to sell fewer magazines. That means fewer $$$ for CR. To say they're noncommercial is to say the stimulus bill was thrifty and didn't waste taxpayer money. On the other hand we have JDP who is run like a professional business. They don't masquerade under another pretense of not being a business. They poll owners based on ownership records available through the BMVs of all states. Their selection is random. Data they obtain is sold to the auto companies, I presume, I do not know that for fact. But the only data more interesting would be the warranty data the manufacturers have about their various brands and models within the brands--and they ain't sharing that info. I was polled in the past at Lowes in a random selection poll. They were stopping every certain number customer and asking them to take part in a poll. It was about golf and how much and when and why I watched golf on TV. At the time Lowes was participating in NASCAR support. But their polling was not like CR's. To be equivalent of CR's polling, Lowe's would have printed a second receipt with an invitation to fill it out asking about your car and mail it back to them if you wanted to do so.
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Replying to: imidazol97 (Mar 20, 2009 5:40 pm) Are you implying that Consumers Union, which is a nonprofit organization, is run in an unprofessional manner? If so, what is the basis for your opinion? Also, when you say CR is "making money just like other businesses", are you questioning their nonprofit status? Or just that they have to bring in enough revenue to pay the bills? |
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Beating up a non-profit and debating that domestic brand owners don't respond to surveys? C'mon, consumer reports has won every law suit they have been in. They don't limit polls to subscribers "We also survey consumers outside our readership to get the most accurate representation of U.S. households. Like the rest of Consumers Union, the Research Center is free of corporate influence and advertising. Its surveys are not commissioned or funded by industry, government, academia or big media. Rather, these surveys are designed to gather unbiased, objective information from consumers for the sole purpose of informing and protecting them." And what is wrong with being a GM Lover? I'm a Honda Lover, but would like to own a BMW one day. Maybe even a used Corvette Z06. You can't deny the fact that GM makes and has made crappy automobiles for over 20 years. Pick a GM nameplate that has been around for 10 years. You think Camry, you think to the reliable car you uncle had in 1989. You think Malibu and you think of the city. You think BMW M5 and Ronan and Transporter pop up. You think Cadillac and you think and episode of Sopranos or rap video. You think Fast and Furious and no GM comes to mind. You think Knight Rider and Commaro comes to mind. You think bailout and AIG, BOA, Citi, and GM comes to mind.
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Smart Shopper Comments: Consumer Reports/JD Power Rankings
