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Can GM make Cadillac the standard of the world Again?

6098 messages,  Last post on Aug 14, 2009 at 4:43 PM

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What is this discussion about? Cadillac Escalade, Cadillac XLR, Cadillac STS, Automotive News


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#5461 of 6098
Re: Cadillac as standard of the world. [carfanforever] by aldw
Sep 18, 2008 (8:04 am)
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Replying to: carfanforever (Sep 17, 2008 6:39 pm)

If BMW is sport/lux and MB is Lux/performance, Cadillac would be best to mix the best of both with its own history, this would make for better Cadillacs yet.
#5462 of 6098
Re: Cadillac as standard of the world. [aldw] by sls002
Sep 18, 2008 (9:01 am)
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Replying to: aldw (Sep 18, 2008 8:04 am)

I think trying to characterize BMW and Mercedes by switching two words around is a gross understatement of the differences. The Mercedes AMG models outpreform BMW's in general at this point in time (but not always). When it comes to luxury, Mercedes is certainly better than BMW. When it comes to sport sedans, both the 3-series and 5-series are probably better than a C-class or E-class. But when you start comparing the M3 or M5, then the Mercedes AMG 63s are hard to beat.
#5463 of 6098
Re: Cadillac as standard of the world. [sls002] by nvbanker
Sep 18, 2008 (9:43 am)
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Replying to: sls002 (Sep 18, 2008 9:01 am)

I'm currently driving a CLS55 AMG. You are right, it's very BMWish, maybe a little faster. Certainly as mysterious, uncomfortable and cramped, and unreliable - very German in other words. But it's scary fast.
#5464 of 6098
Re: Cadillac as standard of the world. [nvbanker] by fintail
Sep 18, 2008 (10:00 am)
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Replying to: nvbanker (Sep 18, 2008 9:43 am)

What has been unreliable about it? Those things do have suspect visibility and AMG seats can be over-bolstered for the growing American physique.
 
The kompressor AMG cars are depreciating as a whole by maybe 1K/month now...I suspect by the end of next year an 06 CLS55 will be able to be had for under 40K, especially with the upcoming facelift and the the 55 kompressor being discontinued.
#5465 of 6098
Replying to bumpy. by carfanforever
Sep 18, 2008 (3:15 pm)
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The thing is, is the "American BMW" concept working?
#5466 of 6098
Re: Replying to bumpy. [carfanforever] by bumpy
Sep 18, 2008 (7:54 pm)
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Replying to: carfanforever (Sep 18, 2008 3:15 pm)

As far as the CTS goes, it seems to be working somewhat. GM lacks the focus and consistency to really make it pay off, though. The DTS and Escalade distract from the mission, and the STS and XLR never got the proper attention. They would do better to flush out everything except the CTS and introduce some more body styles on that line (a stretch CTS, the coupe and wagon that are coming, and a retractable hardtop coupe would do it), but it looks like Caddy is getting a rebodied Saturn VUE.
#5467 of 6098
Replying to bumpy. by carfanforever
Sep 18, 2008 (10:14 pm)
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The current STS is not selling well. It is smaller than the car it replaced, and that reminds me of 1986, when Cadillac replaced the bustleback Seville, which was a big car that was popular and sold well, with a much smaller European-inspired car. That car did not sell well either. I think history is repeating itself.
 
The XLR is a great luxury sports car, (Light-years better than Cadillac's last attempt at this type of car, the Allante) but is has failed too. I think that only underscores my point. People in the market for certain cars will not buy a Cadillac, no matter how good it may be.
 
The Escalade is a good full-size luxury suv. That is an important market now, so Cadillac needs the big truck.
 
Finally, the DTS is the heart & soul of Cadillac. The only problem is that we should have had a new one by now. Cadillac really dropped the ball not investing in it's bread & butter car.
 
A stretched CTS? I would agree if it is stretched to the proportions of the 1998-2004 Seville and replaces the current STS. I do think the CTS variants arriving next year will help, but I do not think CTS variants alone are enough. Cadillac needs new big car products, world-class big car products like it used to do in the past.
#5468 of 6098
Re: Replying to bumpy. [bumpy] by 62vetteefp
Sep 19, 2008 (3:58 am)
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Replying to: bumpy (Sep 18, 2008 7:54 pm)

but it looks like Caddy is getting a rebodied Saturn VUE.
 
A little more than that. Actually it sounds like it should almost be considered a new architecture?
 
Theta Premium
GM is preparing a premium version of Theta. Reports differ, but the general consensus is that it is a combination of the current Theta and elements of the new Epsilon 2 architecture, with some Lambda components as well. So far, the only models are the Saab 9-4X and Cadillac SRX. Despite the fact that these vehicles are loosely based on Theta, which is often used for small CUVs, it is believed that these will actually be midsized, since many have predicted that the 9-4X replace the similarly sized Saab 9-7X. There are also rumors of 7-seater TE (Theta-Epsilon) models under development.
 
Vehicles using Theta Premium:
 
2010 Saab 9-4X
2010 Cadillac SRX

 
I currently drive an Enclave but if they came out with a 6 seater CUV I would go to that. Just need to be able to carry 4 kids. Luggage space is not that important to me.
#5469 of 6098
Re: Replying to bumpy. [carfanforever] by lemko
Sep 19, 2008 (4:08 am)
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Replying to: carfanforever (Sep 18, 2008 10:14 pm)

I bought my DTS because it is similar to the 2002 Seville STS I previously owned. I would've bought a new STS, but it is a way smaller car than my 2002 model and I often get the new STS confused with the CTS as they too close in size. I also seem to prefer the interior of the previous STS to the new one.
 
I realize the DTS is just a facelift of the 2000-2005 car, but it works for me. The facelift makes the car look a lot sleeker, the old taillights reminded me too much of an old Lincoln Town Car, and the interior is way nicer than the 2000-05 car.
 
I would've LOVED it if I could get a RWD/AWD DTS. Maybe next time?
#5470 of 6098
Re: Replying to bumpy. [carfanforever] by sls002
Sep 19, 2008 (6:40 am)
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Replying to: carfanforever (Sep 18, 2008 10:14 pm)

The bustleback Seville did not sell that well, about 33,000 per year. The first generation Seville sold at nearly 50,000 per year. However the small Seville sold at a 20,000 per year rate at first, but finished up at 25,000+.
 
The Deville used to be the best seller of the Cadillac line. Now the CTS is the best seller, perhaps because of price. The DTS (or Deville) is second best. The Escalade is next 35,000. The STS and SRX sell at the same rate, about 22,000.

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