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Automotive News & Views Can GM make Cadillac the standard of the world Again?
6098 messages, Last post on Aug 14, 2009 at 4:43 PM
You are in the Automotive News & Views Forum. Your Hosts are steve_ & claires
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Replying to: sls002 (Jul 18, 2008 6:20 am) GM's reputation for building high quality luxury passenger cars is ruined forever anyway, until every last person who bought a Caddy in the 70's and 80s is dead!  Regards, OW
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Replying to: circlew (Jul 18, 2008 6:29 am) As he said, prior to WWII, it was. That died with the death of custom coach builders. BTW, I don't think that MB or BMW were luxury standards in the post WWII era either. That has only come into play in the last 30 years or so. I do remember reading how Cadillac in the '50's tried ( and succeeded) in "mass marketing" luxury cars, based on the fact that by the mid '60's they were selling over 125,000 deVilles, and by the early '70's, that number climbed to over 200,000 EACH YEAR. Now, if you want to argue that luxury and exclusivity should go hand in hand, OK. Fine. But in many ways, as people back then would retire, get their gold watch, a comfy LaZboy, and then "splurge" on a deVille and ride off into the sunset of their lives, it WAS a gold standard of sorts, in that people aspired to own one. Now, as far as the new CTS goes, if this is any indication of how the brand is going, now adding a coupe and wagon variant, they WILL be a player for years to come. Maybe not the "standard", but a player. You could also argue that with competition from both sides of the world as strong as it is, the true "standard bearer" is the one with the best current product, whether that be Caddy, MB Lexus, or whomever, and that title won't last more than a year or two.
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Replying to: cooterbfd (Jul 18, 2008 6:58 am) Not a global standard. Regards, OW
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Replying to: circlew (Jul 18, 2008 7:09 am) http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Cars-Trucks___Amazing-original-unrestored-Cadilla- c-V16-f-Hyman-Ltd_W0QQitemZ370069641576QQddnZCarsQ20Q26Q20TrucksQQddiZ2282QQcmdZ- ViewItem?hash=item370069641576&_trksid=p3756.m14.l1308 http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Cars-Trucks___Great-restored-1932-Cadillac-Twelve- -V12-f-Hyman-Ltd_W0QQitemZ370069634997QQddnZCarsQ20Q26Q20TrucksQQddiZ2282QQcmdZV- iewItem?hash=item370069634997&_trksid=p3756.m14.l1308
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Replying to: cooterbfd (Jul 18, 2008 7:14 am) Because there are these... link title link title Regards, OW
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Replying to: cooterbfd (Jul 18, 2008 7:14 am) Rolls even had a factory in the US during the roaring 20s, so it must have been enough of a standard to warrant such an expense. MB was virtually unknown in the US before WW2, save for a few movie star types in Hollywood and eccentric east coast , but the custom bodied supercharged cars ranked up there with RR in Europe. Caddy was exported then and was a highline car, but did not trump RR or MB in those markets when it came to prestige or period luxury. It could have been equal in many aspects, but was not an overall standard.
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Replying to: fintail (Jul 18, 2008 7:58 am) Rolls-Royce of America, Inc., founded nine years later with U. S. capital, and British control, began producing cars in 1921. Even before Depression, the makers found that many a well-to-do U. S. businessman, financially able to own a Rolls, hesitated to buy one for fear of appearing unduly swanky in so luxurious a car (average price: $18,000). Rolls-Royce hastened to blast away this sales resistance with advertisements boldly captioned: To the Man Who is Afraid to Let His Dreams Come True. But during Depression the number of such fearful men grew so great that Rolls-Royce sales since 1931 fell off over 50% to $926,000. "Last week, after four years of Depression deficits, Rolls-Royce hit upon a brand new idea. President John S. Inskip put on display in Manhattan a hybrid 'luxury" car, the Brewster "Cabriolet de Ville," with which he hoped to develop a new market. It had a Brewster body, a Ford chassis, a Ford V-8 engine. Price: $3,500. President Inskip had wangled a contract out of Henry Ford to supply engines and chassis in bulk. At the Springfield, Mass. plant of Brewster & Co. Inc., onetime famed carriage makers, now wholly owned by Rolls-Royce, the chassis were to be lengthened and partly reshaped to fit Brewster bodies." Not to mention, RR used coachbuilders extensively, just like Cadillac did. Considering the difference in prices, I guess you would have to say that RR was (and is) in a class all by themselves. The article says that the avg price of a Rolls was $18,000, whereas those V-16 Caddies were between $6-9,000 (unknown if that included coachwork).
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Replying to: circlew (Jul 18, 2008 7:30 am) |
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Replying to: cooterbfd (Jul 18, 2008 8:54 am) Not many Brewster's were built, it was kind of a desperation move. I do seem to recall Charlie Chaplin owned one...I guess that's worth something. And by the decade Caddy would have lower priced cars too. If one is to be the world standard, is price an issue? I think those prices were for Fleetwood/Fisher bodied cars, other custom bodies would be more. |
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Replying to: fintail (Jul 18, 2008 9:01 am) Fleetwood/Fisher were exclusive to the 8 and 12 cyl models. As far as the 16's, other coachbuilders were involved as well. The 8's and 12's ranged in price from$3,295 to $5,800. As for the 16's, my book quotes $5,700 to $9,800. BUT, just like other fine manufacturers of the time,many of these left the factory as a cowled rolling chassis, and the coachwork was custom, leaving many to be considered "one-offs", and their provenance may have to do just as much with their current values as anything. This is where i put Cadillac on par with many of the other manufacturers of the time. I'm sure if someone layed out 12,15,18 thousand for a car back then, attention to detail and craftmanship was top notch, whether the body rested on a Caddy, RR,MB,Packard, Pierce, or any other name.
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