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Cadillac Escalade, Cadillac XLR, Cadillac STS, Automotive News
#4981 of 6195 Re: LOL [m4d_cow]
Jul 12, 2008 (4:50 pm)
Not sure if your comments are directed at me:
What I said was that the CTS might replace the STS, nowhere did I suggest that the STS is really a 5-series car. In fact it is not if the car magazines are right. I do think that the 2008 CTS may be as good as the STS V6. I do think that for the money the CTS is a bargain compared to 5-series V6.
Cadillac is supposed to be working on a smaller RWD sedan that will replace the current B-series available in Europe. I think that it might have been better to terminate the STS and call the new CTS the STS. This would have left a hole where the CTS was, but the new CTS is not a 3-series anyway.
#4982 of 6195 Re: LOL [circlew]
Jul 12, 2008 (4:52 pm)
as I see it, the top luxury car is Rolls Royce, before BMW.
Jul 12, 2008 (11:01 pm)
I do think that the 2008 CTS may be as good as the STS V6. I do think that for the money the CTS is a bargain compared to 5-series V6.
I agree with the 1st statement, but heres the thing with the latter:
True the v6 CTS is darn cheap compared to 535i, but we cant forget that buyers considering 5series normally throw the word value out the window. In the realm of midsize luxury, Infniti's M and Acura RL are the value leaders.
I think that it might have been better to terminate the STS and call the new CTS the STS. This would have left a hole where the CTS was, but the new CTS is not a 3-series anyway.
Before doing that take a look at the competition. Take the M35 as an example, which btw is already considered somewhat lacking in the luxury appointments, yet still have better quality than CTS or even STS, both inside and out. Sit in one, examine the fit-finish, the interior materials, and do the same with CTS and STS. I bet you'll notice the difference right away.
Unlike the 3series market, those are what sell in this market!!! Trying to catch up with the pack means the CTS needs upsizing, new interior materials, and other luxury appointments. The result? Higher price... when that happens the CTS wont be that much of a value anymore.
I believe the CTS sell pretty well right now because its a domestic alternative to BMW 3series and other imports. Bigger than competition means a huge advantage over the cramped europeans. Plus, cheaper maintenance, and I admit its got good handling and soft ride. That might work on entry level market, but what about the midsize luxo?
Just my 2 cents...
#4984 of 6195 Re: Well... [m4d_cow]
Jul 13, 2008 (8:55 am)
I have yet to see the new CTS, as my dealer has not had one in the showroom when my SRX has been in for service. However, looking at pictures of the interior on eBay for both the CTS and STS, I can see that the STS is different and probably better quality. The basic problem that I see is that the CTS is too big to compete with the 3-series in handling. But for those looking for a larger sport sedan at a lower price, the CTS is an excellent car. This is probably why it is a sales success.
The 5-series offers a lot of refinements that the 3-series does not have, in performance and luxury. The STS does not have some of the handling refinements either and the magazines say the STS's interior materials are lower quality than the European's.
My point has been that the STS and DTS will be combined into a new RWD model on a new platform and what this new car will be is somewhat unclear. It will be something like the G8 and perhaps there will be an STS that is an upgraded G8. The DTS will probably be a longer wheelbase G8.
#4985 of 6195 Re: Well... [sls002]
Jul 13, 2008 (9:10 am)
Until Cadillac is made offshore, it will be sub-standard as luxury/quality proposition. Look at the G8/GTO vs. domestic Pontiacs.
That's just the reality as I see. it.
#4986 of 6195 Re: Well... [circlew]
Jul 13, 2008 (3:14 pm)
I think domestic GM interiors are not what they used to be. However, GM's idea of luxury in the 80's was overstuffed velour and I don't think that was good then, much less now. I think that GM interiors are getting better. Until the domestic market is profitable, GM probably will not be a class leader. Cadillac's interiors have been improved, the CTS and SRX interiors are now much nicer than the plastic they had to begin with. The leather in my SRX is not like the leather on my LaZboy though.
#4987 of 6195 Re: Well... [sls002]
Jul 13, 2008 (3:30 pm)
I stopped in and looked at a new CTS at the local dealer earlier this year - I think for the most part, it is competitive with the 3er and C interior, and light years ahead of the old CTS. This thing was loaded and stickered at 49K....that was the only tough part. Get it in a sweet lease deal and it could be doable...
#4988 of 6195 Re: Well... [sls002]
Jul 14, 2008 (4:38 am)
GM's idea of luxury in the 80's was overstuffed velour
Yeah, and the funny thing is, the people to whom I give rides love those overstuffed velour seats in my 1988 Park Avenue and wish automakers still put them in cars.
#4989 of 6195 Re: Well... [circlew]
Jul 14, 2008 (4:41 am)
Oh yeah, the same quality as my brother-in-law's Mercedes-Benz S430 that is PLAGUED with electrical, mechanical, and quality control gremlins.
#4990 of 6195 Re: Well... [lemko]
Jul 14, 2008 (4:59 am)
Ask him if he wants to replace the Merc with a Denali with all new parts! Residual is quite low and he can get it for a steal. Just like all the Caddy's.
2006 CTS 36K miles, Retail Value = $15,740.