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Automotive News & Views Can GM make Cadillac the standard of the world Again?
6098 messages, Last post on Aug 14, 2009 at 4:43 PM
You are in the Automotive News & Views Forum. Your Hosts are steve_ & claires
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Replying to: 62vetteefp (Mar 17, 2008 11:44 am) Do you have anything to back up the BRX or XLR claim? What will be the competition for the BRX, seeing as CTS competition is so tough to define? You're not exactly an objective source either 
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Replying to: grbeck (Mar 17, 2008 11:38 am)
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Replying to: fintail (Mar 17, 2008 12:10 pm) Perhaps not but my info is better than any car mag and rumor mongers  Tyr and point out where I have been wrong with my data Perhaps my term "affordable lux" is wrong. How about more for the money than the competition? CTS is as good as the competition but does not get the higher bucks because of a lack of brand equity?
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Replying to: 62vetteefp (Mar 17, 2008 12:14 pm) Where does the information on these future models come from? More for the money, exactly, this is more positive, and Caddy has indeed pissed away so much brand equity. There is room to capitalize on this, but the work is far from done, even with the much improved new CTS. I guess I can look at so many Caddys from the past 25-30 years, and I still want to see greatness before I believe it. |
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Replying to: 62vetteefp (Mar 17, 2008 11:44 am) Both Car and Driver and Consumer Reports placed it below the Camry and Accord (although both still praised it highly). Also, read Patrick Bedard's rather eye-opening editorial on the Malibu in the newest issue of Car and Driver. He puts the hype into perspective.
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Replying to: fintail (Mar 17, 2008 12:13 pm) |
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Replying to: grbeck (Mar 17, 2008 12:40 pm) Read it. Really said nothing except that GM has had vehicles that have gotten high praise in the past and they did not suceed. Very true and could happen again. As far as CR and C&D, I said article after article discussed the merits of Malibu being better. I did not say every article said Malibu was better. The preponderance of articles do have the Malibu higher than the Accord/Malibu and I guess we could list them all but I would rather not. Lets just say Malibu is a very good car and is doing very well. |
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reference Steve's post Has Cadillac ever really been a world class car? Before World War Two (WWII) my Cadillac history book does not show any "export" models. After WWII there is an export sedan listed as being in production from 1949 through 1960. Sales were about 400 per year until the last couple of years when they dropped off. Obviously some standard Cadillac models might also have been exported, but my guess is that only a few hundred Cadillacs were sold outside of the North American market annually. After WWII the European industry was more or less bombed out, so the US automobile industry was a defacto "world class standard". In the short run the US automobile industry was helped by not having to rebuild. The European industry, because they had to rebuild, could design new stuff. Before WWII, Cadillac had competition in the North American market. I don't think Cadillac was really the best America had to offer. Early Cadillacs were mid-priced cars. In the Thirties, the V16 Cadillacs were the best Cadillac had to offer and perhaps were not matched by anything that Pierce, Packard or Lincoln had, but very few of the V16's were sold. I think there is a consensus here that Cadillac has not been the world class standard since the 1960's. During the 60's very few Cadillac were exported, and most of them were probably used at US Embassies. So, I conclude that if Cadillac was ever "world class", it must have been the V16's that did it. However, I don't think building another V16 will return Cadillac to a world class status. I think for Cadillac to become a world class standard, Cadillac's will have to sell in sizable numbers outside of the North American market. At the very least they will have to sell in the European market. Why anyone in Europe would want a Cadillac instead of a Mercedes, BMW or Audi is not clear to me. Of course the converse of this question is also true: why anyone in the US would want a Mercedes, BMW or Audi is not clear to me with the extra costs of owning them and the lack of service available (the nearest dealers to me are >300 miles away). |
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Replying to: grbeck (Mar 17, 2008 11:38 am) BMW has been consistent with the 3, 5 and 7-series models, but they bring the 6-series into production for a short time and drop it, only to bring it back again. I don't see that the XLR is worth much to Cadillac. It is basically a Corvette. If Cadillac had really built the Evoq, then they might have had something. The sigma platform was not designed to include the Evoq though. Finally, Cadillac's success in the sixties is probably was led to their demise. With too many people driving Cadillac's, and with imports available, people looking for a car to make a statement with were choosing something else. Cadillac's problems with engines in the 80's did not help either. |
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GM could start designing and building all of their vehicles, including Cadillac, to sell in the world market place. Then perhaps GM will survive, and Cadillac will become a world class vehicle. If I were to choose one make that is the current world class standard, it would be Mercedes. For someone in say Africa or South America, a Mercedes is probably as easy to maintain as anything.
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