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Automotive News & Views Can GM make Cadillac the standard of the world Again?
6098 messages, Last post on Aug 14, 2009 at 4:43 PM
You are in the Automotive News & Views Forum. Your Hosts are steve_ & claires
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Replying to: sls002 (Jan 03, 2008 9:16 am)
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Replying to: xrunner2 (Jan 03, 2008 8:18 am) Wrong. I believe Automobile or R&T made upper-midsize luxury with V6 test last year (A6, 530, E320, CTS, V80, S-type, and couple of others) and CTS was rated higest, mostly due to value. I remember being very surprised seing that. |
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Replying to: dino001 (Jan 03, 2008 9:49 am) I think the essence of what J. D. Power's does is found here: LongTermReliabilityfor2004 The rankings show that GM has two makes above average, while Pontiac, GMC and Chevy are below average, but close to average. Saturn is significantly below average. Buick is very good and Cadillac is well above average. This does not mean that any car that you might buy won't be much worse than average though. |
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Replying to: dino001 (Jan 03, 2008 7:40 am) As far as Toyota, with all the news on their quality and recalls, CR did not have much choice but to stop giving them passes. I completely agree.....So somebody had to fill the void so the more reliable better built domestics naturally filled the hole where a Toyota, once automatically was placed.  Is that a conspiracy theory dino001 ?  -Rocky |
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Replying to: rockylee (Jan 03, 2008 9:57 am)  There are so many other choices. Even if their conspiracy to taut Toyota fell apart, they still could choose tons of imports before admitting something domestic being most reliable and recommended. I mean - if there is a real vast anti-domestic conspiracy (is it right wing or left wing?), as you would like us to believe. Or - is it just anti-GM? Wow - what did GM do to all these milions people who dare to refuse to buy their most wondeful product? Or lets narrow it - what did they do to media and CR that Ford gets a pass now and they still can't? I just can't stop wondering... Oh - I have an idea! Perhaps their product is not so great, after all. No - that is impossible. GM has always performed to best of its ability, both in design and manufacturing (with huge help of UAW, of course). And we know their best is the worlds best. It's in the Constitution. So it must be something else... |
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Replying to: sls002 (Jan 03, 2008 9:16 am) So for "under-reporting", then Hondas and Lexi are probably actually better than CR indicates. Maybe these cars should have a higher, more magnificent color schemes than red circles.
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Replying to: xrunner2 (Jan 03, 2008 10:16 am) |
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Replying to: rockylee (Jan 03, 2008 9:57 am) The simple fact is that, for years, Toyota and Honda have garnered the top slots in Consumer Report' reliability surveys. They earned this distinction by consistently producing reliable vehicles across the board. From the magazine's standpoint, it made sense to give their new or dramatically redesigned models a "pass" when it came to predicting reliability. This is not proof of a bias or bribery. If it has snowed on Christmas Day in Pennsylvania for the past 20 years, it is not much of a stretch to say, "We will have a white Christmas in Pennsylvania this year, too." That is not evidence of bias or a conspiracy with the manufacturers of snow blowers and sleds. If it DOESN'T snow on Christmas, that proves the folly of using the past to predict the future. Realistically, the magazine should never have given new Toyotas this "pass" in the first place. (It shouldn't do this for Honda, either.) No model should receive a reliability rating until it has been in the hands of customers, whether it comes from Honda, BMW, GM or VW. As for the "more reliable, better built domestics naturally filling the hole where a Toyota was once automatically placed" - which ones would that be? Even with Toyota's recent reliability snafus, it still ranks third among all manufacturers in the reliability survey, behind Honda and Subaru. Ford, not GM or Chrysler, is the one that has shown steady, consistent improvements, and the Ford Fusion, Mercury Milan and Lincoln MKZ have earned top-notch reliability ratings. GM's rankings still aren't all that spectacular. |
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Replying to: grbeck (Jan 03, 2008 10:28 am) Most of GM's domestic brands are near average (see JDPower link above) except for Saturn. |
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Replying to: sls002 (Jan 03, 2008 10:35 am) How may they be biased? And then, how would that manifest itself into the CR magazine? Trying to think of scenarios. Would a GM loyalist, who also is a CR subscriber, under-report problems he/she is having with a Cadillac to be loyal to the brand? Or, would a loyalist or Cadillac fan, who also might have a relative working for GM/Cadillac, deceptively report zero problems/issues on the survey? Is this a possible way that a reader would show bias?
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