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21515 messages, Last post on Dec 05, 2009 at 7:22 AM
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Replying to: lexusguy (Dec 04, 2009 8:30 am) I agree LG, and I am a member of the BMW CCA. As of now my 2008 335 will probably be my last BMW. Too many compromises for the sake of market share gains and profit growth per unit have offset the tremendous engine and a few other worthy features. I thought it was really galling to see on the press release for their 2011 ActiveHybrid 7 which starts at over $100K, they are charging $400 for the Ipod plug. I paid the same amount for the same plug on my 335, but on their top tier car, it seems even more absurd. They are not the same company that many of us have admired in the past. 
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Wow I know the weaknesses of BMW very well from my BMW 335i experiences. But c'mon let's be fair here. Lack of diesels? BMW has diesels in North America and yes there are rumors that will be bringing smaller diesel engines to North America. Timidity with diesels is not a BMW phenemona. That timiditly spreads among all auto marques in North America. A computer on wheels? Now, now and what exactly are those high end Audi and Benzes and Lexuses and every other premium marque except Lotus? Yup that's right, they are all computer on wheels. BMW has compromises? Ofcourse they do. THey arer not Lotus. They are not going to solely focus on enthusiasts because that would be the road to extinction. BMW does not make cars like in the 1970s/80s because they are no longer in the 1970s/80s. During the 70s/80s mechanical excellence meant everything and electronic excellence meant something you see in an office and not in a car. BMW is a suriviror and the sole survivor among independent luxury marques. Why? Because they make cars that people are willing to spend extra money on. Because they know most BMW enthusiasts are Luddites living still in the 80s with their 1987 BMW M3 watcing Jane Fonda fitness videos. Thier focus is on here and now! And that is why they are a success. They know their market is bigger than the number of people who attend this forum. My rantings about my lemon BMW 335i is a very personal critique and should be treated with a grain of salt here since not everyone owned my BMW 335i. Blieve me I've seen my share of MB and AUdi lemons out there. Run flat tires is an inexusable weakness with BMWs. Go to any tire store and ask the fellow who owns or works in the shop what he thinks about run flat tires and observe the smirk on his face while he tells you what he really thinks about them.
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Replying to: lexusguy (Dec 04, 2009 8:30 am) Because there is a a very small demand for it beyond this forum where everybody hates it. But even with that very small demand BMW will make humungous margins on the suckers who will buy the few X6 M vehicles out there. Nothing wrong with that. If you were in business and customers wanted to buy things that gives you fat profit margins per vehicle would you refuse to sell it? I wouldn't! And BMW certainly wouldn't Despite my criticisms about h large hybrid luxury sedans I think it is smart that they are introducing them if they can make a big profit by selling them at ludicrously high prices. Smart for the automaker but certainly not smart for a buyer of such hybrid vehicles.
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Goodness, I do respect the 3-Series, and I have posted that I'd love to have an M3... but I remember many of the incredible reviews of the 1-Series that I own... they were some of the best reviews of any BMW ever in history, and frankly, even though I am not about to say the 1-Series is better than the 3-Series because I don't necessarily believe it is, I am certainly without any doubt going to say that the 1-series is a terrific BMW in its own right. I can easily say this based upon my own experience with the car. I have driven the car hard and it can take it. I love its performance dynamics, and certainly no one is going to say it is a computer on wheels... in fact, it's a fairly straight forward BMW... purer than many, if not most, of the other BMWs. IMO, the 135i is more about the drive than the fluff. If any of you haven't taken a 135i with a 6-speed manual out for a spin, then you owe it to yourself to do so. After that, you might actually give BMW credit for building it... and find out why it got such rave reviews... and why it is the car I choose to own and drive. TM
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Replying to: tagman (Dec 04, 2009 11:24 pm) On the other side, there's the hatchback, which I tried and wasn't impressed with. BMW pushed the 1er into the small car territory competing with Audi A3 and MB B-class, where it pretty much flops in terms of practicality. So as a niche product the BMW 1-series is really something, but as a mass production car (aka the hatchback).............. |
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Replying to: clembo (Dec 04, 2009 7:40 pm) All luxury cars could be accused of overpricing options. Yuz getz wahtz you payz for! Here is a snip it of a recent Panamer review. The six-digit price syndrome has crept quietly into the luxury-car market in the past few years. It is difficult to keep the price of a BMW 750Li or Mercedes S550, with a few options, under $100,000. Still, I was put off by the test car's $122,975 sticker. Granted, it had a lot of added features, but its overall feel was not commensurate with the price. Its performance was brisk but not breathtaking. The interior is luxurious, but gimmicky with its array of buttons. Its exterior styling is strong, but far from pretty -- I can think of no contemporary cars that share the Panamera's humpback aesthetic. Porsche is known for focusing more on its cars' engineering than its looks. But beauty is a reasonable expectation for customers who pay this much for a car. Its lack of it is yet another way the Panamera misses the mark. Porsce Sedan Now I know the 335i could outmaneuver this big baby, despite the RFT's and no oil dip stick! Regards, OW
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Replying to: dewey (Dec 04, 2009 8:38 pm) To an extent that's true, and MB was actually leading the way towards over-computerized madness a few years ago, but I think BMW now firmly holds that title. To be clear, when I say "computer with wheels", I'm not talking about NAV or media systems, LCD screens, etc. The M5 has a bunch of dumb functions that only seem to serve to make the car worse. Not one of the seven adjustable transmission settings make the transmission smooth or enjoyable to use. Maybe rather than giving the driver seven transmission choices and 400, 500, and 500 "Sport" engine power choices, BMW should've spent the time making the car as good as the one it replaced. That car had no transmission aggressiveness controls and no power settings. The power settings control was the throttle. The Jag XFR still gets it. The M5 just doesn't. It's so obsessed with computers and options and choices that it forgot how to be enjoyable to drive.
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Replying to: circlew (Dec 05, 2009 5:37 am) I pretty much agree with the Panamera review, I drove one about a month ago which stickered about $120K as well. I was actually very impressed with the way the car felt, more than I thought I would be. But thinking about the $120K price combined with having to cringe every time you look at the rear of the car makes it a tough proposition for me. I also agree with your point that the lux cars have high option prices, my IPod point on the 7 was more around - when will this stop? If BMW is going to charge the same $400 for a cheap IPod wire to people who buy a 128i and people who will buy their $106K Hybrid 7, that doesn't show a lot of respect towards their best customers. |
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Replying to: lexusguy (Dec 05, 2009 7:03 am)  Gotta luv it! Regards, OW |
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Replying to: dewey (Dec 04, 2009 8:54 pm) If Motorsport wants to be another AMG, that's certainly their prerogative. If I recall correctly though, BMW deliberately kept the M badge off of the old X5 4.6is and 4.8is because they didn't want it to be like the performance brand that will slap their name on the R-class and G-class to make a quick buck selling over-powered super trucks to idiots. I don't think Audi would ever do a Q7-RS. They could prove me wrong of course, but at this point it still seems like the RS brand is purely about enthusiast machines, which is what M used to be. |
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