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Buick Lucerne vs. Toyota Camry

92 messages,  Last post on May 22, 2007 at 7:32 PM

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What is this discussion about? Buick Lucerne, Toyota Camry, Sedan


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#63 of 92
Re: Engine architecture [62vetteefp] by sls002
Mar 31, 2006 (12:27 pm)
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Replying to: 62vetteefp (Mar 31, 2006 9:08 am)

That depends on tuning. GM 3.6 liter DOHC V6 (in LaCrosse tune) has 225 lb-ft of torque from about 1500 RPM's to over 5000. The Malibu's 3.5 has over 200 lb-ft from 2000 RPMs to about 5000.
#64 of 92
Re: Engine architecture [sls002] by 62vetteefp
Mar 31, 2006 (2:15 pm)
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Replying to: sls002 (Mar 31, 2006 12:27 pm)

Yep. The 3.6 is using new technology that does change things. With variable valve timing it can do a beter job of good torque at the low end.
#65 of 92
Re: Engine architecture [62vetteefp] by sls002
Mar 31, 2006 (3:20 pm)
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Replying to: 62vetteefp (Mar 31, 2006 2:15 pm)

Variable valve timing (VVT) does allow tuning for lowend torque and still provides high speed horsepower. The advantage that DOHC multivalve engines had was that torque would not drop off as the engine speed reached 6000 RPMs, although this was a function of tuning. But DOHC engines tuned for high speed torque would produce a lot more horsepower. Before VVT, tuning for high speed torque would usually reduce low speed torque. A perfect example is the FWD northstar engines, the base engine is tuned for low end torque, while the high performance engine was tuned to get 300 horsepower but low end torque was about 10% less.
#66 of 92
Lucerne vs Camry by sv7887
Mar 15, 2006 (11:21 am)
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Hi All,
  I don't think the comparisons to a 4 Cyl Camry have any merit. I've owned 4 Lexus LS400/430's and a Toyota Tercel and Corolla.
 
My point is: Toyota isn't perfect. Lexus service in the Boston area is one of the worst I have encountered in a long time. I used to drive a 1989 Buick Park Avenue and it was a fantastic car with great dealer support.
 
All this talk of Toyota value is overrated. My Park Ave never broke down and when there was a problem it wasn't that expensive to fix it. I just paid $1,700 on a new Power Steering rack for my '92 Lexus LS400 with 97K on it..I've had to nearly sue the Lexus dealer because of fraudulent repairs. Lexus Corporate was no help.
 
I bet that repair would have been half the $$$ on a Buick. My son's new 2006 Corolla rattles like crazy. The tires are Goodyear Integritys' which got some of the worst ratings on TireRack. Not very impressed with Toyota these days.
 
The Buick Lucerne is a great car. I've seen them in person and am very impressed. It is a much better value than the Avalon with eye catching styling. I can't think of a single car below $35K that has a V-8. I've driven the ES330 many times and noticed the jerky transmission right away. The new interior of the ES350 is nothing special.
 
Is the Lucerne perfect? No, but what car in this segment is? All I can say this is one of GM's best cars in a very long time.
 
-Sam
#67 of 92
Re: Lucerne vs Camry [sv7887] by m1miata
Mar 15, 2006 (11:39 am)
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Replying to: sv7887 (Mar 15, 2006 11:21 am)

You were very lucky not to have bought an '87 model year. I had an Olds98 and the window had a whistle to it, the engine stopped running some times. They replaced a mass air flow sensor, programmable operation manager, tried numerous adjustments, and finally changed the crank case sensor. The transmission blew at 62K miles. The paint on the roof top went bad. The handle for the brake release came off. The rear window mirror fell off. I am sure I forgot some stuff, but you get the picture. All of this was in about 3 years time. This was a car that sticker priced around $20K back when. I paid around $18K. About 3 1/4 years, give or take, later the car was a $6k something, trade-in.
 
As for the Lucerne, if GM is in business, the car has a good reliability record for two years, and I could find a good used V8 for under $20K, I would consider one. Or a DTS. The Lexus line up seems overpriced to me. Nothing too interesting in the low end line-up by Lexus.
 
-Loren
#68 of 92
Re: Lucerne vs Camry [sv7887] by pmerk28
Mar 15, 2006 (3:25 pm)
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Replying to: sv7887 (Mar 15, 2006 11:21 am)

"The new interior of the ES350 is nothing special."
 
Yeah it's only the best in it's class. Every Lexus interior is special. GM interiors are normally awful.
 
"It is a much better value than the Avalon with eye catching styling."
 
The Avalon looks just as good maybe better. I doubt the Luceren's resale will match the Avalons. Your point on repair costs are well taken though and the Lucerne looks to be a very good effort from GM. I might give it a look even though I'm barely into my 30's, not 65 like a normal Buick buyer.
#69 of 92
Re: Lucerne vs Camry [pmerk28] by 1487
Mar 15, 2006 (4:22 pm)
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Replying to: pmerk28 (Mar 15, 2006 3:25 pm)

If you think the Avalon looks good I doubt you are in your 30s. The Avalon is not attractive from any angle. Basically it's a bloated camry. The last Avalon was so ugly that everyone is making a big deal about the current one because it's not as bad. Taking the car on it's own merits it isnt that good looking.
 
"Yeah it's only the best in it's class. Every Lexus interior is special. GM interiors are normally awful. "
 
Get caught up with the times. I would like you to name 5 terrible GM interiors, not including models being replaced this year like the trucks.
 
Please check out pics of the Lucerne, lacrosse, enclave, Vue, GTO, Escalade/Tahoe, Impala, DTS, STS, cobalt, torrent, 9-5, 9-7x, etc. before talking about how bad GM's interiors are. The ES350 has a nice interior, but that doesnt mean GM's interiors are bad. I think the DTS' interior is comparable to the new ES, but not the Lucerne. Lexus makes great interiors, but when you check out some of toyota's more affordable offerings like the Corolla, Rav4, Sequoia, Highlander and FJ Cruiser you will Toyota interiors arent all they are cracked up to be. Fake wood can only take you so far. I would take a modern GM interior over a dull Toyota interior any day. Only exception would be the new camry.
#70 of 92
Re: Lucerne vs Camry [sv7887] by tjc78
Mar 15, 2006 (4:55 pm)
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Replying to: sv7887 (Mar 15, 2006 11:21 am)

You forgot the Crown Vic / Grand Marquis. Maybe the V8 Lucerne is a value, but comparing the base model with the ancient 3800 to a base model Avalon its not even close. I am comparing the two right now although Buick advertises the V8 for 30,000 I have yet to see one on the lot under 34,000 with the V8. You can get an Avalon touring with heated seats, leather and stability control for under 32,000. I haven't started pricing them out yet, but I bet the Toyota will give a much better lease, due to the vehicle holding its value better.
#71 of 92
Re: Lucerne vs Camry [1487] by m1miata
Mar 15, 2006 (6:30 pm)
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Replying to: 1487 (Mar 15, 2006 4:22 pm)

My first impression of the new Avalon was that they made a car similar to an Oldsmobile. Not too bad, other than a bit awkward up front. The new Camry needs a little re-work on the nose too. Front wise the Lucerne is a bit cleaner looking. Its eyes are a bit big, but I take it that's better to see you with.
 
As to interiors, it looks like a good job was done on the Lucerne, and Impala, but the Cobalt looks cheap to me.
 
-Loren
#72 of 92
Re: Lucerne vs Camry [pmerk28] by robchemist
Mar 16, 2006 (9:29 am)
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Replying to: pmerk28 (Mar 15, 2006 3:25 pm)

The discussion of how good an interior looks, seems to me, silly at best. Presumably, if one is driving a car, one is not spending time looking at the interior. Maybe a glance down at the instrument cluster or radio control, but that would be about it. If one does spend lots of time looking at the interior of your car, all I can say is that I really do not want to be on the road when that person is driving!

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