Ask the Car People.SM


MINI Cooper Clutch & Transmission Questions

542 messages,  Last post on Mar 03, 2013 at 5:15 PM

You are in the MINI Cooper Forum.

What is this discussion about? MINI Cooper, Transmission, Convertible, Hatchback

    
Go to NHTSA to file a safety complaint.
Or call Monday-Friday (8 am to 8 pm ET) (888) 327-4236 TTY: (800)424-9153

Messages Page 54 of 55

#528 of 542 My Mini Cooper S Clutch Story in full by ctartsmorley

Dec 26, 2012 (12:03 pm)

A cautionary tale about making a Mini purchase from Stevens Creek Mini:
SUMMARY: For those who don’t want to read a book, here is a summary with the full account of my dealings with Stevens Creek Mini following.
I am the currently embittered, disaffected, cynical second owner of a 2008 Mini Cooper S purchased from Stevens Creek Mini in San Jose, California. I wanted to love this car for years to come. I no longer have confidence in Mini as a brand or Stevens Creek Mini as a dealership.
Within the first 19 months of ownership I have had to spend $4394.71 to maintain this car. I thought I had all the protection I needed having purchased an extended warranty, maintenance and tire protection packages. In the end I feel I have just wasted my money.
The car was sold to me with 2 practically bald front tires one of which had a bulge (they didn’t look bald or defective to an untrained eye) $729.70 to replace. The tires were not covered under the tire protection package as tread was found to be too worn to qualify.
The Clutch burned out at 28,003 Miles. This was not covered under my extended warranty, and I was told it was “user abuse”. I have been driving a manual transmission for 20 years and NEVER burned out a clutch. The Service writer told me “one bad hill in San Francisco” could burn out a Mini clutch. Other employees at the dealership mentioned that clutches are notorious for problems. If they are notorious for problems then why aren’t they covered under warranty on a 4 year old car with less than 30K miles on it?
Aside from all that I would like to point the tires out again, in order to connect the clutch to the tires for you as they suddenly connected for me. Isn’t it strange that 3 months after I purchased the car I was told I needed new tires? Would this not suggest that whoever traded the car in had decided to have some “fun” with it before getting rid of it? What kind of tires wear out after 16, 617 miles? Again what kind of clutch wears out after 28k?
My Mini Horror Story:
I purchased a 2008 Mini Cooper S from Stevens Creek Mini in San Jose, CA on March 26, 2011. I chose a used Mini cooper because I didn’t want the new car price tag; I loved the sportiness, ease of parking, and had hopes of saving on gas and insurance.
 The car had 16,617 miles on it and was equipped with all the comforts a person could ask for. I am aware of the fact that this is a “luxury” sports car and with that I could at some point expect some rather costly maintenance bills, none of which I expected to occur within the first year and a half of ownership. Along with the purchase of the car I procured extended warranty, maintenance, and tire protection packages.
 I am so sad to report that my Mini experience has been far less than stellar. Within the first 6 months of ownership I think at about 19000 miles I was told I needed to purchase 2 new tires as the car was sold to me with unacceptably worn front tires one of which had a bulge in the sidewall. I was aware of the fact that the tread was a little low when I bought the car, but they are low profile tires so I could not tell just how low. Upon test drive it was suggested to me by my friend’s dad (a mechanic) that I rotate hose tires to the back of the car. When I went in for my first service I was told that you don’t rotate the tires on a Mini, you just replace them as they become worn. This was not explained during the purchase of the car. In fact no one really walked me through the car at all. Once the sale was complete they took the car, washed it, handed me the keys, showed me a few bells and whistles on the interior and that was it.
Hindsight is 20/20 and I probably should have demanded new tires be put on the car before taking delivery. Unfortunately I assumed (naively) that Mini of Stevens Creek would not sell me a car with what pretty much qualified in the Mini world as bald tires, I was obviously wrong in that assumption. As mentioned I purchased a tire protection package, I had hoped this might cover at the very least the tire with the bulge in it, nope. I was informed that the tread was too low on the tire for it to qualify for coverage under that package. Due to my own financial difficulties it took me 9 months to replace the tires, two Continental run flat tires (no room or a spare in a mini) out the door runs $729.00.
2 Weeks ago I noticed the clutch started slipping and that the engine was rattling on start. I took the car in to Stevens Creek Mini to find out what was wrong. One of the service department employees drove me around in my car unable to replicate the noises I was hearing or the slip in the clutch. I have to point out that he drove my car ever so gently; I don’t know anyone who drives like he did, that is unless one of your passengers is holding a very hot cup of coffee. He did point out that my clutch felt stiff so I mentioned again that it seemed to be slipping sometimes in 2nd and 3rd gears. He casually stated that I would probably have to have it replaced but not right now. They took the car into the shop and checked my fluid levels which were low, they topped me off and asked me when the last time I checked my fluids had been. I told them I never checked them. I was horrified to learn that I needed to be checking them once a month. This was the first time in the 19 months I have had the car that anyone had told me I needed to be checking my fluids. Right after I got the car I called Mini of Stevens Creek’s service department to ask when I was supposed to come in for service and I was told that there was an indicator that would light up for 2 seconds that would show the approximate date and mileage I would need to bring the car in, and that there was NOTHING I needed to do until then. I was NEVER told that I needed to check my fluids monthly. This was distressing because I could have blown my engine. I left the dealership on 9/21 believing that my car was fine only to be back with a burned out clutch, fly wheel and broken timing chain guide on 10/05.
On October 5, 2012 my four year old Mini had 28,000 miles on it. My husband was driving my mini to take our son to school; he tried to enter the freeway shifting into second gear going about 15 miles per hour when the car would not shift into gear. The engine just revved and nothing happened, he switched to 3rd gear and after a little more revving the engine slammed into gear. He managed to get the car home at which point I decided to take it to the dealership. I got in the car and immediately knew the clutch was almost gone, there was a horrible smell and I had to let the clutch almost all the way out before the car would move.
As stated in the summary I have driven a manual transmission for my entire driving career, 20 years at this point. I have NEVER burned out a clutch. My last car was a 2003 VW Jetta GLI, my husband cut his teeth on that clutch and we didn’t have to replace anything but a slave cylinder at over 80 thousand miles.

#529 of 542 My Mini Clutch Continued by ctartsmorley

Dec 26, 2012 (12:05 pm)

When I got to the dealership I was told clutches only burn out at 28000 miles due to “user abuse” and that it would not be covered under warranty. I was also told that If the car had had 50,000 miles on it the repair would have been covered because that is considered normal wear and tear. I don’t believe any clutch should burn out at 28,000 miles; I honestly don’t even know what you have to do to punish a clutch so hard that it burns out at 28000 miles. I am not an abusive driver and I do not believe I am at fault for the burn out especially after having a service writer tell me that Mini clutches are so sensitive that “one bad hill in San Francisco can take your clutch out.” In fact I would at this point like to state that I am positive that I, being a very proficient manual transmission driver managed to squeeze the last of the life out of a clutch that was probably already on its way out at the time I purchased the car, given the condition of the tires. Had Stevens Creek Mini really wanted to cover its tracks they would have changed those tires before putting the car on the lot. As stated previously it has become painfully obvious that whoever owned the car before I took possession raced the hell out of it.
After leaving my car at the dealership I went home and did some internet research. It seems Mini’s are notorious for clutch problems, but Mini USA probably doesn’t want to acknowledge this, as it is a VERY costly repair. Many other drivers having the same experience as I have, got the same line from the dealership, “the clutch burned out due to user abuse.” While this might be true in some cases I have a hard time believing that so many veteran manual transmission owners would experience clutch failure after so few miles.
On October 12, 2012 I got the call from the dealership letting me know that my car was ready. I will say that I was pleased that the repair only took one week. I went to pick it up and asked to speak with the General Manager; I wanted to tell him about my experience at his dealership. I felt he needed to know about my buying experience, my disappointment in the product that was sold to me, and the fact that I was not given very important details regarding care and maintenance of my car. I was pretty much told that he was out to lunch and that if I wanted to I could speak with the service manager, (it was also implied that the GM couldn’t really be bothered to speak with me because he was a very busy man). I conceded and waited for the service manager for 10 minutes before I was told he was out to lunch too but that he would give me a call. The service manager did call me about 2 hours later (I had gone home by then) at which time I gave him a detailed verbal account. He apologized for my experience and said that he understood that Stevens Creek Mini had failed me in some ways. He also told me that he was on his way up to meet with the GM and would talk to him about my experience, though he wasn’t sure if anything could be done. He also stated again stated that he inspected the parts himself and chalked my clutch failure up to user abuse. I thanked him for his time and we hung up.
 
I now have ZERO confidence of Mini of Stevens Creek; I don’t believe they really care about customer service, user experience, or even customer safety for that matter. If they really cared, I would not have been sold a car with bald tires. I am not sure about Mini as a brand but I don’t think I will be purchasing another Mini because I don’t want a car that is so fragile it can’t take a hill or forgive any kind of manual driver error, which I still deny.
I have walked away from this experience feeling like the biggest sucker; my once beloved car is tainted and I wish I didn’t have to drive it anymore. Unfortunately I still owe on the car, so much to my chagrin I will be driving it for many years to come. I might not feel so bad if I’d not had to hand over approximately one year’s worth of car payments all in one day, or if Mini of SC had offered to take some responsibility and cover half the cost of repairs as a good faith gesture. I do however live in the real world, and I have more than once been made to realize that if people (especially people at car dealerships) can screw you for money, they will.

#530 of 542 Any connection between brake work and tranny? by txmini

Jan 09, 2013 (1:16 pm)

I recently took my 2006 MCSC 6-speed automatic to a shop for brake work. Brakes were fixed (including new sensors) and when I picked up my car, the transmission was a mess as soon as I left the parking lot!! They tried to diagnose it but couldn't so they had it shipped over to the local Mini dealer. They tell me that 1-3 gears are fine but 4-6 are gone and I need a whole new tranny. However, when I asked for the specific codes they got, they say there were none. Hmmm...
 
Two questions:
1.) how can they know for sure what needs to be done if they didn't get any codes??
2.) is there any way something could have happened during the brake replacement that could cause some sort of electrical-type problems with the tranny??
 
I am not going to spend $9k for a new tranny so I am looking for options. Any advice is greatly appreciated.

#531 of 542 Re: Any connection between brake work and tranny? [txmini] by Mr_Shiftright HOST

Jan 09, 2013 (6:55 pm)

Replying to: txmini (Jan 09, 2013 1:16 pm)
So the transmission was absolutely fine when you drove in? If so, I think you need to pursue this with the garage that did the brakes. I mean, there are speed sensors involved in CVT transmission operation, and maybe some re-learning to do if the battery was disconnected or discharged. It just seems implausible that the transmission would go from good to bad the minute you drove out of the repair shop.
 
If you are in the San Francisco Bay Area, I could send you to a place that actually knows how to repair a MINI.

#532 of 542 Re: Any connection between brake work and tranny? [Mr_Shiftright] by txmini

Jan 10, 2013 (7:57 am)

Replying to: Mr_Shiftright (Jan 09, 2013 6:55 pm)
Transmission was perfectly fine before I took it in. The Mini dealer has scanned it and says "no codes" show up. I asked about relearning/reprogramming and they said there isn't any reprogramming required - that is not what I see when I look on various forums. Is there a more specific process that I could tell them to go through to make sure this is not something electronic? Since 1-3 gears are fine, someone told me the car could be in some sort of "preservation" mode that allows it to work at a minimal level to get to a repair shop. Have you heard of this?
 
Unfortunately I am in San Antonio TX so I am too far from your recommended shop.
 
Thanks for your feedback.
Julie

#533 of 542 Re: Any connection between brake work and tranny? [txmini] by Mr_Shiftright HOST

Jan 10, 2013 (9:00 am)

Replying to: txmini (Jan 10, 2013 7:57 am)
maybe you could check out the reputation of this outfit in San Antonio?
 
http://www.sanantonioeuro.com/
 
I do want to caution you, though---if anyone else REPAIRS or attempts to fix the transmission, this *might* let the original garage who did the brake work off the hook--so you'd have to limit it to diagnostics, and if the diagnostics show some damage to speed sensors or wiring, then you have a legal gripe with the shop that did the brake work.
 
Here's the text of a Technical Service Bulletin that gives some info on "re-learning", but I don't know if this is applicable to your current symptoms:
 
SI M 24 01 09
Automatic Transmission
January 2009
Technical Service
SUBJECT
R50/R52 CVT; Engine Speed Flaring on Deceleration
MODEL
R50, R52 Cooper with CVT transmission and W10
SITUATION
 
The customer may complain of engine speed flaring ("engine revs up") during a closed-throttle deceleration from highway speeds. No faults are stored in the EMS2K/MS5150 (DME) control module.
 
CAUSE
 
Unfavorable CVT (Continuously Variable Transmission) gear ratio adaptation
 
CORRECTION
 
Clear the CVT long-term gear adaptation values, and perform the complete transmission "adaptation teach-in" procedure, according to the instructions below.
 
Important Note:
The unfavorable gear adaptation values may be erased, and the correct values can be relearned, by occasionally driving the vehicle in "Sport" or in "Manual" (Steptronic) mode.
Please advise the customer that occasional changes in driving mode (Sport or Manual modes, from time to time) would prevent the engine speed flaring condition from occurring.
 
PROCEDURE
 
To clear the CVT long-term gear ratio adaptation:
 
1. Connect the vehicle to the ISID/GT1, loaded with the latest diagnostic software.
 
2. Select "Service Functions"; then "Drive" and "CVT gear".
 
3. From the second column, select "Replacement/adaptation, CVT transmission" and then "Test Plan".
 
4. Scroll through the next screens and answer "Yes" to the question "Is it necessary to delete adaptation values?" After the CVT gear ratio adaptations are deleted, perform a complete transmission "teach-in" procedure, as follows:
 
Clutch adaptation:
 
1. Press and hold the brake pedal. Start the cold engine.
 
2. During a cold start warm-up phase (idle speed is slightly increased), shift from P to N for 10 seconds, and then shift to D for 10 seconds. XP will be displayed in the instrument cluster.
 
3. Repeat the following sequence 10 times: shift from P to N for 3 seconds, and then shift to D for 3 seconds. XP will be displayed in the instrument cluster.
 
4. Repeat the following sequence 10 times: shift from P to N for 3 seconds, and then shift to R for 3 seconds. XP will be displayed in the instrument cluster.
 
Gear ratio adaptation:
 
1. Accelerate the vehicle to a speed of 50 mph. Release the accelerator pedal and allow the vehicle to coast down to a stop. The transmission adapts itself when going through 4,500 rpm, 4,000 rpm...and 1,400 rpm engine speeds. P will be displayed now in the instrument cluster.
 
2. With the engine at the operating temperature (idle speed stabilized at 800 rpm), repeat Clutch Adaptation steps 3 and 4.
 
3. Turn the ignition off.

#534 of 542 Re: My Mini Clutch Continued [ctartsmorley] by busiris

Jan 16, 2013 (11:10 am)

Replying to: ctartsmorley (Dec 26, 2012 12:05 pm)
I realize this complaint is a it dated, but I thought the attached link might help shed some light on why so many S-model Mini's seem to experience some form of clutch failure. Notice down the article that there are many other models experiencing clutch issues with dual-mass flywheels.
 
This isn't an excuse nor a defense, just information...
 
Hopefully, this info will at least help those with clutch failures understand the issue better.
 
http://www.honestjohn.co.uk/faq/dual-mass-flywheels/

#535 of 542 Re: My Mini Clutch Continued [busiris] by txmini

Jan 16, 2013 (8:11 pm)

Replying to: busiris (Jan 16, 2013 11:10 am)
In my case it is a 6-speed automatic. Does this still apply? There is no way to "ride the clutch" so how would this happen?

#536 of 542 Re: My Mini Clutch Continued [txmini] by Mr_Shiftright HOST

Jan 16, 2013 (8:35 pm)

Replying to: txmini (Jan 16, 2013 8:11 pm)
No, it doesn't apply to your situation.

#537 of 542 Re: My Mini Clutch Continued [txmini] by busiris

Jan 17, 2013 (4:10 pm)

Replying to: txmini (Jan 16, 2013 8:11 pm)
No, it doesn't. Automatics are completely different animals, as Mr_Shiftright indicated.

Messages Page 54 of 55

To POST a message, please Sign In.

Advertisement

Browse by Category

Browse by Vehicle
   View All Vehicles

Browse by Board
Browse by Topic
View All Topics

Edmunds Community

Advertisement