Last post on Mar 14, 2013 at 8:16 AM
You are in the Cadillac CTS/CTS-V
What is this discussion about?
Cadillac CTS-V, Cadillac CTS, Sedan
#494 of 2880 Re: 
Jan 31, 2007 (8:51 am)
You know what the problem is here? You can't take any type of criticism on of a GM car. You'll come up with one excuse after another as to why GM cars are so this and so that. At no point did I say that the previous CTS or the new one was junk. Didn't say that at all. You have such a big chip on your shoulder when it comes to defending anything GM to the point where you make no sense at all. You seem to also think that someone is trying "win" someone over here. That is just lame, I coudln't care less about winning over anyone here. You don't seem to be able to understand anything. I said I actually saw the new CTS at Detroit and liked it, yet you come back and say I hate all Cadillacs. Ridiculous.
Sales dont count for anything, but your opinion and C&D's are gospel.
Why is that you're so hung up on sales? Now you asked for proof of what I stated earlier about the early takes on the previous CTS..then when I proved to you that it wasn't just something I made up, you come back with this sales BS. Most GM cars sell well and have done so for years and years, even when they were junk...so what does this prove? You can harp about sales forever and ever, it is only 1/2 of the equation....the other is how the car actually stacks up when compared. You'll just twist and spin to whichever point suits the GM car at the moment. One minute the car is a "success" then the next you say "I didn't say it was a great car". Talk about mass confusion, lost in a hypocritical mess.
Yes, the STS interior cannot compare to the sea of black E class interior. If you ask me those two cars are both trailing the GS when it comes to interior design.
Its called picking another color for the interior!
BTW, did you ever notice the CTS is the oldest car in its class right now except for C class? Just wondering. You keep going on and on about how bad it is when it's about 6 months away from replacement.
Classic "let us forget about the old car because the new one is coming". You couldn't have come up with a better way to prove my point about your excuse making. Nevermind the current car, wait till next year's model. Classic, classic, classic.
I thought it was normal for the oldest car in class to be inferior to newer models with fresh designs, but maybe that's only me.
Uh..the C-Class and CTS and A4 are all inferior to the 3-Series at this point incase you didn't notice. The C-Class didn't even have a decent engine until the 2006 model year so it was just as much of a laggered under the hood as the CTS was interior-wise. The A4 is still a nice car, but the 3, G and IS have moved the game onwards. I have no problem admitting when a Mercedes has been caught out, unlike you with any GM product. A 335i or G35 crushes a C350, A4 3.2 or your CTS at the moment.
#495 of 2880 Re: 
Jan 31, 2007 (8:57 am)
Kind of like you do when you quote C&D when they bash GM products (right down your alley) and then say they are biased when they routinely rank MB products behind BMWs and occasionally Lexus models. C&D is always right EXCEPT for when they don't rank your favorite brand #1 in comparisons. Got it.
Wrong again. I haven't said anything about a Mercedes in a C&D comparo in years. In case you hadn't been paying attention Mercedes has been on a winning streak with them anyway. The SL550, S600, S550 and E63 all winning comparos lately. Only the E550 lost one and surprise(!), unlike you I don't and didn't cry foul when the E550 lost. Beating the snot out of that GS450h may have had something to do with it!
When any publication ranks an underdog highly you tend to think that vehicle really impressed them. When C&D praises Hondas and Audis it really doesnt mean much because they love everything those brands put out.
Honda they do like, but not everything Audi. The just tested the S8 and basically said it wasn't worth the money over the regular A8. That isn't "love".
When C&D has been bashing American cars for the last 30 years or so and they like an American car (like '08 CTS) it tends to hold a little more weight because you know they are not fans of the brand or the automaker.
Problem is you almost got this right, but I agree with them thinking highly of the CTS is impressive. Problem is that you're in denial as to why they've been "bashing" (i.e. in the real world telling the truth) about American cars for 30 years. American cars weren't up to the competition to put it very, very lightly. Nine out of 10 times those "American cars" deserved every harsh word they got, but you'll say that they didn't and it goes on and on. Denial about the past at its best.
#496 of 2880 Re: 1487 [merc1]
Jan 31, 2007 (10:08 am)
Actually what your reference to the Car & Driver says is that the ride and handling is very good. Some other things are not so good. The reference to the 10 year old 7 series (a much more expensive car) was not about handling. The power steering feel, a common GM problem, was not as good as it should be. to quote the article above:
"the sophistication of the Caddy's suspension impressed the testers, leading one of us to write, "The CTS has a quality chassis. It's very fluid through the curvy stuff, predictable, and easy to drive. Body roll is almost imperceptible"
#497 of 2880 Re: [merc1]
Jan 31, 2007 (12:16 pm)
So many words to say so little. As you know (but others may not) I have documented problems with GM vehicles time and time again to you. Alas, your selective memory precludes you from recalling those instances but I assure I have made it very clear that I can find fault with many of GM's vehicles. My list would probably start with the H2, Colorado/Canyon, Vibe and Aveo but I can think of quite a few more of their products that I dont like. The problem here is the same as it's always been, you cant stand that people dont share your dim view of the CTS and every other car in GM's stable and thus you continue your futile attempts to convert us to your line of thinking. Keep on typing, wont change a thing.
"Why is that you're so hung up on sales? Now you asked for proof of what I stated earlier about the early takes on the previous CTS..then when I proved to you that it wasn't just something I made up, you come back with this sales BS."
You are so right, sales dont mean anyting. If you say the CTS stinks that you are 100% correct. "Sales BS"- LOL........I like that line. You provide one quote and in your world you have "proven" the CTS was a piece of crap. Why dont you look up some reviews from sources that actually liked the CTS when it came out and then get back to us. BTW, just for the record (not that facts are relevent to you) I never said the CTS was a class leader. DOn't let that stop you though.
"Classic "let us forget about the old car because the new one is coming". You couldn't have come up with a better way to prove my point about your excuse making. Nevermind the current car, wait till next year's model. "
Let me make this "classicly" clear to you. Pay close attention: When the CTS was new it was competitive in it's class. Now in the year 2007, the CTS is dated and is near the rear of the class because its been surpassed by newer models like the 3 series and IS. Got it? I'm sure you don't but that is the best that I can explain a relatively simple point. You are the only one who doesnt get this. If you were to say the C class is a bottom feeder at this point because it's 7 years old I would agree, I wouldnt say you are making a "classic" excuse. Older cars bring up the rear and this is hardly news to anyone but Merc1.
"I have no problem admitting when a Mercedes has been caught out, unlike you with any GM product."
Lies, untruths and exaggerations continue. Classic! Yes, I confess I truely believe that every GM product is best in class and I have never found fault with a GM product. I've been exposed!
#498 of 2880 Re: [merc1]
Jan 31, 2007 (12:29 pm)
"Honda they do like, but not everything Audi. The just tested the S8 and basically said it wasn't worth the money over the regular A8. That isn't "love". "
Um, that doesnt constitute C&D hating Audi. Sure the S8 may not be worth the premium but that is because they are saying the base car is so good. As I said, they love everything Honda and Audi make. Stop arguing about things that are universally accepted. Next you'll be arguing about the existence of gravity.
"Problem is that you're in denial as to why they've been "bashing" (i.e. in the real world telling the truth) about American cars for 30 years. American cars weren't up to the competition to put it very, very lightly. Nine out of 10 times those "American cars" deserved every harsh word they got, but you'll say that they didn't and it goes on and on. Denial about the past at its best. "
There have been decent American cars hitting the market for the better part of a decade. Was every domestic model as good as it should be? no. Is every Japanese model that is praised by the press offering much more than these same "mediocre" domestic cars? No. When cars like the Camry, Corolla, Accord, Sonata, etc. get praised and similar domestic cars are criticized for being dull, FWD or unexciting I tend to disagree with your sentiment that magazines are always fair. It's all about double standard, when the Asians make a dull car it's OK but when an american car offers the same attributes it's insulted for being boring and the writers start asking for a return to to glory days of RWD muscle cars. Most cars on the market are far from exciting, its just that this is accepted when those vehicles come from Asia or Germany.
Seems like I'm totally right (as opposed to almost) in this instance. I gave you an extensive list of nice American cars from the past 10 years weeks back and you made up excuses about every one of them (except Contour SVT) even though WHEN THEY WERE LAUNCHED much of the press liked these vehicles, EVEN your much loved C&D. Thats what's great about being merc1, selective memory always kicks in at the right time.
Jan 31, 2007 (1:55 pm)
/me pulls up a chair, starts the Hibachi, and grabs a beer.
Nice litle war we've got going. Of course, I get most of my reviews lately from 5th Gear/Top Gear - because when they don't like a car... they REALLY don't spare one bit of their ire.
It's not a bunch of jaded reviewers who think that 6 seconds is as slow as a sloth and isn't worthy of even being considered(Car and Driver), or incapable of saying anything bad about it(Consumer Reports - "Needs improvement" seems to be as harsh as they go), or other magazines which just spit out facts and not much else.
Oh - Top Gear hated the CTS, btw. They said that it lacked refinement and the interior was cheap, to put it nicely - but that it did drive very well. Of course, they also pointed out a couple of better GM alternatives for the money - just... models we don't get here in the U.S. Blame GM on that one. They are very eage to get their hands on the new one, though - so their review should be worth watching.
#500 of 2880 Cadillac Good Deals
Jan 31, 2007 (3:52 pm)
If anyone is looking for a GMID deal on a new Cadillac Hummer GMC or Pontiac please contact me - acavinssewell.com
#501 of 2880 Has anyone heard/seen anything yet............
Jan 31, 2007 (4:01 pm)
On the next CTS-V ? I can't wait to see what the interior will look like on the "V"
#502 of 2880 Re: Cadillac Good Deals [acavins]
Jan 31, 2007 (4:04 pm)
What's GMID ?