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22203 messages,  Last post on May 15, 2013 at 12:39 PM

You are in the Mercedes-Benz E-Class Forum.

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Messages Page 2217 of 2221

#22160 of 22203 Re: A7 [james27] by tlong

Apr 08, 2011 (7:01 pm)

Replying to: james27 (Apr 08, 2011 3:16 pm)
Those 3" are exactly the reason why I ended up with a BMW 535 GT, it was one of the few cars that actually had some decent headroom.
 
I hear the Scion xB has a lot of headroom, too.

#22161 of 22203 Re: A7 [tlong] by james27

Apr 08, 2011 (9:43 pm)

Replying to: tlong (Apr 08, 2011 7:01 pm)
But I thought this was the LUXURY lounge...
 
It really frosts me that some of the nice cars are only available here (in the USA) with a sunroof, and that can take as much as 3 or more inches out of the headroom. On an A6 I owned awhile ago, you could still order it without, and the difference was 2.85" extra headroom. Personally, I can easily live without a sunroof...higher insurance, higher center of gravity, more sources of squeaks, less torsional rigidity, and more expensive (in Germany, the GT's sunroof is optional at 1700 Euros...an amount I'd much prefer spending on other things!). Mercedes had the sunroof 'optional' for awhile, their 'base' price was lower than some comperables, and the salesman told me all sorts of people came in and complained, 'but it's standard on X'; not associating that their base price was inflated because of it. As a nation, we are pretty poor about understanding this sort of thing...too bad. I much prefer the old way where you could cherry pick the items you want, especially, if the manufacturer allows that in their home market (i.e., Germany). While you can get packages, and it can save money if you want most of it, it's really annoying to spend say $2000 to get one thing that's available in their home market for $200, and you could easily live without the others. The hassle here is many of those brands are only marketed as 'luxury' cars, where they, with less content, are sometimes a commodity vehicle in the home market, except when optioned out with all sorts of really nice stuff. On most, we can't buy it without leather, for example, and on most of the mid-size cars like the A6, 5xx, and Exxx, it's optional in the home market, and, you can get it in an ecconomical 4-cylinder engine...it still is built well, but costs maybe 10's of thousands less. So, you get what you pay for. Here, we're too stuck up, expecting the cache of the brand to only represent certain things. It would just be too much for someone to have a neighbor with a car that looked the same on the outside to cost $25K less than yours...we're just stuck up...

#22162 of 22203 Re: A7 [james27] by tlong

Apr 08, 2011 (10:13 pm)

Replying to: james27 (Apr 08, 2011 9:43 pm)
It really frosts me that some of the nice cars are only available here (in the USA) with a sunroof, and that can take as much as 3 or more inches out of the headroom.
 
Can you custom order without a sunroof and go European delivery with Audi, BMW, or MB?

#22163 of 22203 Re: A7 [tlong] by plekto

Apr 09, 2011 (1:25 am)

Replying to: tlong (Apr 08, 2011 10:13 pm)
Actually, yes. There are a number of changes that you can get via European delivery that aren't on the web sites and so on. I've heard of custom colors, upgraded leather, and all sorts of other things as well for some extra money. As well as things like being able to delete a sunroof, get cloth seats, and even sometimes get a manual that's not normally available (or often simply not ordered by dealers in the U.S., even though it is technically offered somewhere in their forms.)
 
Plus, the interesting this in most European delivery programs are almost the same price as buying it locally and you get to be pampered for a day, tour the factory, and see Europe for a few days or longer. They're hoping to get a bit of kickback from the tourist packages the agencies they have deals with, of course.

#22164 of 22203 Re: A7 [tlong] by james27

Apr 09, 2011 (3:32 pm)

Replying to: tlong (Apr 08, 2011 10:13 pm)
Unless you may be in-country when you order and purchase the car (diplomatic sales), you are buying the car from the US arm, even though you are picking it up in Germany. There are certain options (with BMW at least) that you can only order on the car (i.e., the dealer can't order them that way for their stock - they have to be assigned to an actual end user customer), but after multiple requests, the US arm of BMW refuses to sell a vehicle with 'deleted' standard equipment (as defined by the US arm). I know, I've tried. IOW, they will NOT sell the GT without a sunroof in the US.
 
I wrote a letter to Mercedes and had the local dealer ask on an E-class, and no they would not build one for US certification without a sunroof. Also had the AUdi dealer check, and (at least on the models I was interested in, no). On that car, at least in the current models, the difference in headroom is huge, nearly 4" with and without the sunroof. I'd easily fit in that car without a sunroof, but with it, I'd not want to own it.
 
Now, maybe if you're talking like something in the Bently, RR, Aston, etc., yes, they'll bend over backwards, but not on the commodity vehicles (and no, I don't wish to spend anywhere near that much money on one of those). Got enough money, and all sorts of things can be done.
 
In Germany, for home market consumption, almost everything is a la cart. But, once it goes through one of their other country sales offices, they and the factory decide what is available. For example, the BMW UK branch treats the GT the same way as the US...the sunroof is standard equipment, but they have other things that are standard that are optional here (if even available). So, it is a country by country thing.
 
Without lots of work and extra money, with the EPA and safety requirments to bring a car into the US, it is not practical for the average person to buy a Euopean spec vehicle and expect to register and drive it in the US. Plus, the US branch won't honor the warranty of a grey market car, even if you could get it past the Feds.
 
It needs to be clear...when doing a European delivery, you are NOT buying it direct through the factory, you are still buying it through a US dealer, and it must meet the US arm's set of requirements. And, while there is a little more flexibility, it isn't really all that much. Maybe in the past, but not now.

#22165 of 22203 Re: A7 [james27] by plekto

Apr 09, 2011 (6:05 pm)

Replying to: james27 (Apr 09, 2011 3:32 pm)
Well, that's unfortunate. I know it is different for specific manufacturers, though, and Audi/Porsche seem to be a bit more open to that sort of thing. (custom paint/custom leather/etc) The A7 may be high enough in price that a letter or two to the right people might get them to make a fairly reasonable change as that - ie - "I can't physically fit in the car but I want one - could you please make me one without a sunroof?" If it's non-functional or non-safety related, (ie - EPA won't care about the change) it should be possible.
 
You'd have to likely get the ball rolling in Germany first, though, since the U.S. branch of most manufacturers is more like a franchise and really has no options or say in things. They U.S. side will likely have a fit and get their shorts in a wad, but it should be possible. (my guess is that the corporate pencil-heads don't want to alter the paperwork to include a custom option or recalculate the price). Myself, I hate sunroofs so much that I'd pay FOR the sunroof to not have it installed.

#22166 of 22203 Re: A7 [plekto] by james27

Apr 09, 2011 (6:26 pm)

Replying to: plekto (Apr 09, 2011 6:05 pm)
I'll make my thoughts clear to the person I talk to when I pick up the car, but I doubt it will make much difference. Another simple thing, I'd like the homelink, self-dimming mirror, but it is part of a big package with other things I really don't want. It's available as a separate item in Germany. I like the feel of the sport steering wheel, but it's part of the sport package which has things in it I don't want - available as a separate option in Germany. Really expensive to have changed out here, as the airbags are different, so you have to buy that as well. The dealer can do it, but it is a $200 option in Germany to swap upon order processing, but in the order of $1400 here to have a dealer replace it (the airbag is expensive, and then they have a nearly new, but not, airbag and steering wheel you probably wouldn't get any credit for).
 
There are advantages to being tall, but it can be a major challenge in everyday life as well. The world is made for average people, tall or short are an afterthought. Every once in awhile, someone quite tall gets into a decision making position, and there's some exceptions on what's available, but the bean counters usually nix it.

#22167 of 22203 Leather or MB tex by blckislandguy

Apr 15, 2011 (7:06 pm)

I'm seeing a fair number of otherwise optioned up E Class Mercedes in showrooms without leather but M B Tex. There must be a problem with MB's leather vendor. I can't see a luxury car mfg passing up the opportunity to gaffe the cusomter with an expensive option.
 
The interesting thing is that the MB Tex is standard and not an extra cost option, looks better, and lasts longer. This could be the start of something. I wish I had MB Tex on my Silverado. The General's leather is already cracking and wearing thin after only 3 years. (In contrast the leather on my 05 Cayenne looks hardly sat-in.)

#22168 of 22203 Re: Leather or MB tex [blckislandguy] by plekto

Apr 15, 2011 (9:08 pm)

Replying to: blckislandguy (Apr 15, 2011 7:06 pm)
All leathers for automobile use except for the highest-end full grain leathers are manufactured these days. Mercedes is at least honest about theirs not being real leather. Also, being that they were the first to make the stuff back in the 60s, (!), they ARE the standard by which the others try to (mostly unsuccessfully) copy.

#22169 of 22203 Re: Leather or MB tex [blckislandguy] by carnaught

Apr 16, 2011 (9:44 am)

Replying to: blckislandguy (Apr 15, 2011 7:06 pm)
The General's leather is "ap-cray" as is Acura's.
 
MB Tex wears very well but their extra-cost leather's aromatic smell is almost itself worth the price of admission.

Messages Page 2217 of 2221

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