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Sedans Luxury Lounge
21520 messages, Last post on Dec 08, 2009 at 10:26 AM
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Replying to: cyclone4 (Jan 02, 2009 9:05 am) IMO - pure reaction to Russia and an over-reaction to the middle east. Did you see how out of sync expectations were of build vs usage on Wednesday. Build was substantially higher than expected last week as US demand continues to sink. Oil was headed under $37 on that data when the Russian nat gas cutback was announced and that reversed the trend. But come contract month end who in the trade is in need of buying that oil given the continuing build each week? Folks will either have to stockpile it or cut price heavily to dump it. I actually paid my lowest premium price yet today - $1.63.
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Replying to: louiswei (Jan 02, 2009 4:05 pm) BMW 328xi: $35.6k(base) / $47.3k(loaded w/ automatic) / $45.9k(loaded w/o automatic) Those BMW prices are lower than I saw. I got $47.3K for the Audi with standard paint, 19" Sport package, wood trim, ADS, and NAV. Ticking literally every box brings it up to a bit over $50K for ACC and the rear sunshades. Setting up the BMW with the same equipment as the Audi will cost you $49.3k with the AT, or $53K with ACC and the rear sunshades, and 19" wheels are not available at any price. Genuine BMW 19" wheels will cost several thousand dollars I'm sure, and you'd have to spend at least $1500 for aftermarket wheels. What I'd like to see from Audi is a 300hp/310ft.lb A4 3.0T, the same engine from the updated A6, priced the same as the current 3.2. That would allow them to compete directly with the 335i and G37. I have to assume that the A4 3.2 will be replaced by a 3.0T version, the current engine just doesn't cut it.
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Replying to: louiswei (Jan 02, 2009 5:48 pm) Because the M3 sedan loaded will be mid-upper $60. This is how Audi operates, the S cars perform and are priced below M and AMG, and the RS cars perform and are priced above M and AMG. It's a somewhat weird system and it might help them to get rid of it and go directly at BMW and Mercedes model for model, but they don't seem to want to change. The new RS4 will probably hit $70K, but it will be a monster. Whether a 335xi is a better choice than an S4 depends on your definition of "almost the same". |
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I am no oil expert but based on what I read the average marginal cost of worldwide oil production is about $55 to $65. In the short term oil prices can fluctuate above or below $55 to $65 but not in the long term since marginal costs will creep higher and higher as "cheap to drill oil reserves" dry out. It is very fortunate that the Saudis are good friends of ours since they have the cheapest oil. Without them world oil prices would be far higher and we would be more dependent on thugs like Putin, Chavez and that charming fellow from Iran. So enjoy these low oil prices as long as they last because they wont last too long unless demand drops substantially due to a horrific prolonged global depression. So let's all pray for higher oil prices and continued prosperity in Saudi Arabia. 
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Replying to: lexusguy (Jan 02, 2009 8:43 pm) That is just sooo 20th century! The greener , the more reliable, the more practical , the more luxurious and last but not least the more technologically sophisticated Lexus HS250 sounds far more 21st century to me. I will take the Lexus HS250 anyday over these two Germanic relics of the past. Sushi is in. Sauerkraut is out.
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Replying to: dewey (Jan 02, 2009 9:52 pm) Sushi is in. Sauerkraut is out. Happy New Year! I guess you don't like to really drive, then! The trick will be to preserve the driving performance and achieve high efficiency at the same time which tends to be mutually exclusive at the level of existing technology. It must be created. Today, the sauuerkrauts of the world have the best driving dynamics IMHO. The efficiency of a BMW I6 would be greatly improved if the weight was reduced. The Holy Grail of a compact car should never exceed 3,000 lbs (1,361 KGS.). For a car in the 128i/135i class, it should weigh no ore than 2,500 lbs (1,1134KGS.). A bullet-proof HO 4-banger needs to be the new world standard. The balance of today's performance cars will be to achieve 20 - 30 MPG and keep close to 300/300 in the power category. Over 300 HP will be hard to achieve the stated efficiency without advanced hybrid technology to support the IC power. Regards, OW |
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Replying to: circlew (Jan 03, 2009 7:50 am) Everytime I feel happy in my car I can almost predict I will soon get a ticket. In the short term oil prices can fluctuate above or below $55 to $65 but not in the long term since marginal costs will creep higher and higher as "cheap to drill oil reserves" dry out. Pardon my illiterate writings on my last post. What I really meant was the following: In the short term oil prices can fluctuate above or below $55 to $65 but not in the long term since during long periods prices tend not to deviate too far from marginal costs. Despite that fact it is inevatable that marginal costs will creep higher as "cheap to drill oil reserves" dry out.
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Replying to: dewey (Jan 03, 2009 8:44 am) From everything I've read for the Saudi's and most of the Middle East the marginal price is about $5 as their capacity easily outweighs what they are pumping. For America it's about $45 because we are tapped out and we need a $55-65 price to make drilling worthwhile.
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Replying to: ljflx (Jan 03, 2009 8:57 am) The $55 tp 65 dollar figure is the average world marginal cost of oil as of June 30th 2008 from the magazine called the Economist. Fortunately the highest marginal cost producers are Venezuala, Iran and to a lesser degree Russia. Oh and let me not forget Canada's high cost Tar Sands. USA petroleum is not the costliest to drill but unfortunately there is not enough of it. |
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Replying to: louiswei (Jan 02, 2009 11:20 am) I hear you. I'm somewhat disappointed by their pricing strategy as well. Regardless of MSRP the 2008 model A4 cost only $1200 less than comparable 3series AWD in this area. The bloated price will make it worse imo. Of course, given Audi's superior popularity over BMW in this area it may not bother them much in the end... As optimistic as I am on Audi's future, I'm expecting them to become a strong player globally, like Asia (except China and Korea) where MB normally rules (and overpricing like hell) or Europe where higher price (over BMW) never really bother them that much, not in US. I actually paid my lowest premium price yet today - $1.63. Good for you, ljflx. Premium in my area never dropped to less than $1.69/gal (2 weeks ago). Now? A solid $1.75 like back in the early 2000s... 
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