Luxury Lounge

Replying to: lexusguy (Oct 21, 2008 12:13 am)

Replies to this message:
• circlew (Oct 21, 2008 3:36 am)
• bmlexus (Oct 22, 2008 2:05 pm)

Replying to: tagman (Oct 21, 2008 3:32 am)

Replying to: tagman (Oct 20, 2008 5:58 pm)

On a side note, I think the Germans are going to benefit from all of these changes, but they will need to introduce their newer, more fuel-efficient products sooner than they had anticipated
 
Sorry Tag but I will have to wholeheartedly disagree with you 100 percent with this one particular statement of yours above.
 
German auto makers are in very serious trouble. MB and BMW, Audi and Porsche are in the worst segments possible during slower global economic times. Their engineering is first rate. Their marketing strategies are first rate. Even their customer satisfaction statistics have improved substantially during the years. All 4 marques have done every single thing they could do except one thing. WRONG MARKET SEGMENT!
 
Suzuki auto sales are booming.
Is it because of their engineerng?
 
Is it because of their marketing strategies?
 
Is it because of high customer satisfaction
 
Nope it's because they are in the right market segment! That's the only reason.
 
Honda is doing better than Toyota solely because it does not have V8 trucks and SUVs. Toyota is the leader not only in terms of sales but also in terms of technologies that really count for the future (hybrids, plug ins). Honda luck resembles the luck of Suzuki in terms of having offerings that are biased towards fuel efficient vehicles.
 
What about the other German calledVW? They have the best prospects among the Germans primarily because their product line caters more to the frugal types.
 
The economy dictates market demand. Auto enthusiasm is independent of the economy and that is why many of us here discuss Italian exotics without ever intending to buy one of those overpriced lemons.
 
When the economy booms again then luxury German marques will luck out. But waiting for that boom may involve the patience of Job.
 
.

Replies to this message:
• clembo (Oct 21, 2008 8:32 am)
  • circlew (Oct 21, 2008 8:59 am)
  • tagman (Oct 21, 2008 9:02 am)
  • dewey (Oct 21, 2008 12:34 pm)
    • jimbres (Oct 21, 2008 1:24 pm) and 2 more...
    • clembo (Oct 21, 2008 4:39 pm)
    • cdnpinhead (Oct 21, 2008 4:40 pm) and 9 more...
  • tagman (Oct 21, 2008 9:11 am)
    • hpowders (Oct 21, 2008 9:20 am)
• hpowders (Oct 21, 2008 10:43 am)
  • tagman (Oct 21, 2008 11:41 am)
    • hpowders (Oct 21, 2008 6:37 pm) and 12 more...
  • dewey (Oct 21, 2008 12:43 pm)
    • tagman (Oct 21, 2008 1:05 pm)
    • hpowders (Oct 21, 2008 1:18 pm) and 8 more...

Replying to: dewey (Oct 21, 2008 7:22 am)

Dewey - I agree with some of your points that you've rasied but you also need to consider that the German companies have been raising prices pretty significantly over the past couple of years. Now that the Euro is down over 15% from its highs March - August the companies are realizing increased profit per vehicle sold. Now if volumes decline sharply they will have unabsorbed fixed overhead to deal with but it will take a huge volume slide to offset this profit increase.
 
It also gives them choices to subsidise leases to gain volume or offer other incentives to increase sales. I agree that this segment will come under pressure due to recent economic changes, but in most industries the high end consumer has been less affected than the lower end when it comes to income and spending patterns. There are areas of the country where expensive homes are still selling well but low end homes don't move, the car industry may go the same way for a while.
 
At the end of the day I don't think any of these companies would switch places with lower end brands. I do agree with you that the reason that we are here discussing these expensive cars is that econmic factors don't always dictate our interests. Most of us are fortunate to be able to drive some nice cars and even dream of the fancy Italian lemons that you've highlighted.

Replies to this message:
• circlew (Oct 21, 2008 8:59 am)
• tagman (Oct 21, 2008 9:02 am)
• dewey (Oct 21, 2008 12:34 pm)
  • jimbres (Oct 21, 2008 1:24 pm)
    • circlew (Oct 21, 2008 3:37 pm)
    • anthonyp (Oct 22, 2008 2:18 pm)
  • clembo (Oct 21, 2008 4:39 pm)
  • cdnpinhead (Oct 21, 2008 4:40 pm)
    • tagman (Oct 21, 2008 7:04 pm) and 8 more...

Replying to: clembo (Oct 21, 2008 8:32 am)

Replying to: clembo (Oct 21, 2008 8:32 am)

Excellent post... you saved me from a lot of typing.
 
I agree with you. Dewey makes very good points, and he presents them well, but your reply adds the perspective that I share with you.
 
TM

Mr. H.!
You would definately hurt yourself in a 135i... you are right when you say the power is excessive. The car is not for you.
 
The entire auto industry is under pressure. BMW will be fine, unlike General Motors, for example.
 
TM

Replies to this message:
• hpowders (Oct 21, 2008 9:20 am)

Replying to: tagman (Oct 21, 2008 9:11 am)

The 135i is exactly for me. I choose not to own one. Wasted power in the USA. I've been down this power-trip road once before, TM.
 
 Having the wife drive the VW will open up a wonderful new world for me-that of the impractical vehicle. Sounds nice....but I will believe it when I see it. Nothing on order yet.
 
 I read your posts "elsewhere" to the dude who couldn't make up his mind in choosing between the GTI and the 128i. I agree that if one really loves driving, the 128i in stock form will be a more satisfying experience than the front-drive GTI. The only choice I will be making if given events fall into place is 328i coupe vs 128i coupe. Different dealer, though.

Replying to: dewey (Oct 21, 2008 7:22 am)

Hey Dewey!
 
I agree with you that BMW is hurting in NA. The entire leftover 2008 BMW model line in the USA is going for an unprecedented 0.9% financing at this time. As if that isn't bad enough, the 2009 models have already started showing up on dealers' lots at this time, making a huge glut of unsold BMW vehicles going forward inevitable. Also, BMW has shot itself in the foot by making their leasing terms undesirable. If BMW thinks people will buy BMW vehicles long-term at 0.9% and risk expensive warranty repairs after 4 years, instead of leasing short-term, their nuts!! Big mistake!! These potential customers will simply go elsewhere.
 
With the significant quantity of unsold 2008's now being joined by an onslaught of soon to be unsold 2009's, I see BMWFS offering 0.9% on the 2009 models by the second quarter of 2009. The only choice BMW has in the USA to avoid catastrophe at this time is to seriously cut production of its vehicles.
 
I resent your labeling me as a VW owner, "frugal." Haven't I been the guy who spares no expense on buying the world's best rum so my wife can continue to manufacture her intensely-satisfying rum cake?
 
 I was looking for a German, fun to drive, relatively fuel-efficient, practical vehicle that could hold my 68" road bike in the back. There weren't that many choices out there. Idiotic BMW chose to release the totally useless X6 instead of a practical hatchback variation of the 1 Series which really could have been something, that I and a lot of folks would have been interested in. Too bad.
 
The wife is making a serious attempt at learning how to drive and if she gets her license, I will give her the VW and buy myself an impractical fun to drive vehicle like the 128i Coupe. I have issues with the Coupe's external appearance. However, the way I plan to drive it, nobody will see it anyway!
 
After driving the 545i for three years, and not even being close to tapping its power resources, the last thing I want is a 135i.
 
Happy Driving!

Replies to this message:
• tagman (Oct 21, 2008 11:41 am)
  • hpowders (Oct 21, 2008 6:37 pm)
    • lexusguy (Oct 23, 2008 3:33 pm) and 11 more...
• dewey (Oct 21, 2008 12:43 pm)
  • tagman (Oct 21, 2008 1:05 pm)
  • hpowders (Oct 21, 2008 1:18 pm)
    • tagman (Oct 21, 2008 3:06 pm) and 6 more...
    • dewey (Oct 22, 2008 6:29 pm)