Last post on May 16, 2013 at 9:57 AM
You are in the Chrysler 300M
What is this discussion about?
Chrysler 300M, Sedan
This topic covers any issues related to hard starting, no starts, stalling and erratic idling problems.
#169 of 195 Re: 99 300m [pitmanoeuvre]
Aug 06, 2012 (4:05 pm)
Hello! We are going to go crazy if we can not start my 2000 300M. Timing belt, waterpump, 3 sensors, a relay so far have all been replaced. Everything is connecting. It just isn't catching a spark. It wants to start but just won't. It even has had the battery jumped off. I am desperate. Our family depends on this vehicle. Is there anyway that you could send me a copy of the manual you are speaking of? We have a Haynes manual but I don't why it's like it just isn't enough info. I thank you for any help you give in advanced. jatwil42yahoo.com.
#170 of 195 Re: 99 300m [jatwil42]
Aug 06, 2012 (7:26 pm)
jatwil42 : Any time any engine that almost starts , sputters or whatever - I always do 2 things. The very first , is to pull out any spark plug and attach it to a clamping device (I make my own) which will allow you to rebolt the clamp onto a grounding surface (preferably the engine block) , so that you can have a helper attempt to spot any spark coming from the coil , when the engine is being cranked over. For safety's sake , it would be best to mark and remove all coils/spark plugs , so that the engine will not start in the process. Nothing like having an engine start with 1 wire sparking outside the motor. That's not really safe. In alot of cases , you can get a shock from the wire or boot too , it happened to me and nearly killed me. I was holding a wire off of a high performance engine which had the large size Accel Supercoil , and was running. I got out of the car to check a sputter , but should have shut it off before laying my hand on the inner fender , which just happened to be exactly where a wire had jumped off. I touched it and got stuck to it like magnetics. Good thing a friend was with me and pulled me off the wire. That took some guts , as those coils can produce up to 40,000 volts. In the case of the 300M , each spark plug has it's own coil , so each one may need to be done to identify a couple or a few or more coils/spark plugs which are faulty. This can also be done better at dusk or in dim lighting so that you can see any difference in the spark size (brightness). If any coil & spark plug combination produces a very dim spark (as opposed to any of the others) , chances are the coils for those cylinders are hardly working. That will cause an engine to sputter and be unable to run normally every time.
The 2nd thing I would check is the fuel delivery system. (You must ensure that you check the spark of the plugs/coils first , as you don't want to be testing open sparks after you have opened the fuel lines , or you have gas fumes in your garage etc.) The order of testing is important. Without spark , or ample relative spark across all 6 cylinders , there is no need to question the fuel system until the spark is adequate throughout each cylinder.
Alot of times I have found profusely blocked fuel line filters , which wouldn't allow enough fuel through them to be passed onto the injectors. This will create a no start or coughing condition at the cylinders. NOT ENOUGH GAS. On the 300M , you lift the rear seat and the fuel line filter is attached on top of the gas tank. If it appears brown or discoloured , it's been overlooked , and not changed , possibly since new. Change that in line filter and pay close attention to the directional instructions of the filter. Most have an arrow indicating the direction of fuel flow. Flow should obviously be directed to the engine.
***If you want the Chrysler Service manuals , it's best to get them on the CD I provide , so that you can view them in PDF format (Adobe Reader) , on a laptop or computer while you work on the car itself. About a week ago someone else took me up on my free offer , so I sent the entire 10,000+ page collection to Ohio for $2.80. It's free if the cost is under $5.00. All you have to do is send your mailing address , or the address that you want the disk to arrive at to me into my email box : bhthwhyahoo.ca
I will send the CD out to you right away.
**One other note : is that the 300M's computer system etc. pays close attention , and relies upon the signals coming from each spark plug etc. If just 1 of the coils or spark plugs is bad , the engine timing etc. cannot be properly calculated by the computer (electronic system etc.) , to be automatically adjusted for best performance : IE : idling. This is also why it is of the utmost importance to stick with the factory recommended spark plugs etc. I use the NGK - Laser Platinum Premium spark plugs on my 2002 300M Special (3.5L High Output Special - dual exhaust) [ NGK # ZFR5LP-13G spark plugs] Any decent parts store will caution you not to try different spark plugs , as they have had returns because of poor to bad performance. The proper spark plugs for your engine should be on the radiator / hood latch support decal. If not , check with a Chrysler dealer etc.
#171 of 195 Re: 2002 300M starter clicks but later starts. Starte replaced 8 times now [jcpaintworkz]
Oct 09, 2012 (6:58 pm)
Starter problems solved -Now!!!
FIRST --THE BATTERY : Charge the battery fully. See if car starts.
2nd Clean the battery posts taking care not to reduce the size of the posts, negative post in particular
3rd Most important -- clean the negative ground sites.. that means take a wire brush, clean off all paint, dirt, grease to the metal surface!!. Clean the negative ground site on all the negative cables, connections, including the fuse box and if possible the positive cable sites thoroughly. Spray hair spray over the connections sites when finished. ( has shellack in it -prevents corrision)
3-A if car starts ck battery fully ,,see if alternator is charging - a freebie auto zone!
4 start car.
5 If starter is turning over, not starting -- replace the starter relay in the fuse box !!
.6 start the car.
6.-A If not starting starter is cranking engine push accelerator to the floor !
Hold accelerator to the floor cranking engine 20 seconds. Stop,, wait 10 full minutes start car if car starts you have injector issues or sensors
7 ,if not starting ,,starter is working ,, disconnect the negative cable,again.
wait 1 full minute -reconnect this clears sensor codes. if car starts its a sensor problem
8 if car does not start fuel pump may be defective and/ or fuel filter
put your nose to the end of the car exhaust area --smell any gas? If not fuel pump problem.
9. You smell fuel not starting ,, take a spark plug out be sure to ground it on the engine,,,see if a park is seen. If not ck the coils .
10. if spark is seen ck plugs if not ok-- replace plugs with Champion plugs.(OEM)
11. car still does not start ,, recharge battery,,
If it starts most likely car starts when cold,,, either starter relay or injectors are bad.
If when car is hot when it stalls you have problems , ck the EGR valve this is under the windshield wiper are ,, a pro mechanic needs to do this as its hard hard work.
11.A injectors when hot can leak fuel,, the fuel rail has to be depressurized
by pulling the fuel fuse & cranking the engine for 20 seconds Then you can take out the fuel injector line after -- you take out the windshield wiper cowling ck for leaks by pressurizing fuel rail injector line , ( keep under pressure for 30 seconds looking for leaks.
12 None of the above apply ,, ck computer codes ,,gas cap,, cannister codes.
13 its time for the stealership, as most likley the ECM is shot!!
Crankshaft sensor ,camshaft sensors can be faulty ,, ck with Auto zone if you can most often these are ok, they go at about 100k so look at your mileage. codes should have shown up if car is running.
#172 of 195 Re: 2002 300M starter clicks but later starts. Starte replaced 8 times now [jacksyak]
Oct 09, 2012 (8:57 pm)
To clarify what it means when your starter , just clicks - it means 1of2 things or both are wrong. Firstly , the starter solenoid (which is primarily , just a switch that is connected to your ignition key cylinder - which resides in conjunction with the starter motor inner mechanism) is worn out , or more often than not , the starter motor armature is worn to a point where it no longer turns freely. This is called : wedging or jamming (out of center alignment of the armature with the field winding contacts). In a starter there is an armature , very much like the ones inside of a drill motor , which spins whenever the solenoid contacts are fed power through the ignition cylinder key power connections. When the starter motor is worn , it can't spin freely or properly even if and when the solenoid contacts are working , which cause power to enter the starter armature. This is why you only hear a "click". Sometimes , this "click" will occur , followed by the starter actually turning the motor - and is a telltale sign that the starter motor is worn , or is about to fail soon (normally). But - if your starter has been installed incorrectly , where the inner worm gear is misaligned , you can hear the solenoid switch "CLICK" , because the worm gear is jamming. This is common , "IF" , the starter motor is not installed correctly. Normally , any time you turn the ignition key to the start position , you should hear the starter turn the motor - or attempt to. Clicking solenoids can be heard where the engine will not turn as well. This is why - clicking solenoid sounds on their own , are NOT NORMAL.
Then lastly , besides both the starter motor solenoid , or the starter motor armature , there still remains the possibility that the starter has not been carefully mounted into it's proper mounting position. If a replacement starter assembly (both new - solenoid and starter motor inside a refurbished or new casing) are "THROWN" into a transmission casing mount without clearing any corrosion/debris/rust/unevenness etc. , the new starter can possibly jam when used. What happens in this case , is that the "worm gear" attached to the starter solenoid/armature , misaligns itself with the flywheel or any other type of connecting gear which turns the engine , when the key is turned to the start position. The worm gear is specially designed to spin towards the connecting engine turning gear , whenever power is fed to the solenoid/armature. When you release the key from the start position , power no longer activates the worm gear , thus the starter is then entirely in a neutral position , where the worm gear is also in a neutral position. You have to be wary of a mechanic who does not pay close attention to the alignment of the starter motor casing/s , so that they fit flush , where there is no odd looking connection made with the 2 casings. The existing casing , can be sanded or filed to ensure a good fit with any new starter , while you can have alot of problems if a new starter is "THROWN" into it's position carelessly. Even bolting the new starter on can be done incorrectly when the alignment was not paid any attention. When you allow this type of repair to occur , chances are - you might have trouble down the road , or just around the next corner.
*In fact - this has happened to me with a Ford Dealership , where I got into my pickup after driving it approx. 50miles (after having engine work done where the starter had to be removed & reinstalled) [the starter was only a month old] , and the starter turned over , but wouldn't stop spinning - so the engine was running with the worm gear in it's engagement position with the flywheel. I was not going to drive it like that - so , being that even when the key position was in the run position - the starter was still running at a high rate of speed , I had to get out and take off the positive battery terminal cable to get the whole mess to stop. I restarted it , and luckily I got it home , where I released the starter bolts / removed the starter , and then "reinstalled" the starter - where there were no problems afterwards , for years. I even sold the vehicle , after a couple years , and the new owner , didn't have any problem either. To be specific : when you install a starter , 1 hand should be holding the starter casing/assembly in it's proper position , and pressing towards the mount (from it's end) [not from it's side etc.) , while the other hand is torquing the nuts or bolts tight. This is where it also means alot , as you have to do both simultaneously , without allowing the starter to shift. And - you don't just snug up or finger tighten the nuts or bolts - you have to be torquing the nuts or bolts while you are maintaining the proper starter motor position. Finger tightening while the starter is held from behind , is not enough , and then returning to torque the bolts - because the starter can still slightly shift where you didn't see or feel it happen. "Works every time".
#174 of 195 Re: 99 300m [pitmanoeuvre]
Jan 31, 2013 (2:13 am)
I would like to get a copy too, I'm so frustrated having changed cam & crank sensors and still not able to start my car. It started fine a few weeks ago. I just read about the key lockout issue and hoping it might be that. Can you use Dropbox it make the pdf downloadable.
#175 of 195 Re: 99 300m [genenyc]
Jan 31, 2013 (5:49 pm)
Just this past 10 days or so alone , (8) owners have received the extensive 300M Chrysler Service Manuals from me - so , there is a postage cost involved in receiving it now , as the total sent is reaching 35~40 thus far. Plus the Canada Post Office nearest me , decided to make some money off of all of this - by ripping me off , and stating (charging) me , 50% more above the original and "LEGAL" costs - on their own private accord. This was confirmed by me personally at another Canada Post Office , who actually charged me less than the original costs I was paying (prior to the 50% hike claimed by my local office). I DO NOT provide the 10,000+ pages service manuals for download online - but , if you send me your name and the address where you want it shipped to (and agree to send me ample postage to my address in return to cover postage costs) , I will send you a copy of the manual compilation. Let me know at : bhthwhyahoo.ca
Feb 06, 2013 (7:23 pm)
I have read thru this forum and have seen others with the same problem as i am having on getting their 300m to start. My boyfriend and i parked our car one night with it running fine and went out next day to start it and it wouldn't start. It cranks over but wont start. We initially thought it had froze up since that night it got REALLY cold and was first night it had done so since i bought the car. We had it taken to a friends garage and put it in the heat and it still wouldn't start. We started first with the spark plugs then the crank sensor. Took the crank sensor back and traded it for the cam sensor and still nothing. It isn't getting spark. Can anyone who ha had the problem as well please help? Been without a car now for two months.
#177 of 195 Re: 1999 300m wont start [tntalways1020]
Feb 06, 2013 (10:19 pm)
tntalways1020 : The problem could be fuel related , or there is an Automatic Shutdown Relay inside the PDC (Power Distribution Center) - this is marked : Fuse & Relay Center on the plastic engine compartment cover. The ASD Relay , protects the entire electrical system from damage due to current overload within the system , plus it also requires a minimum of current flowing through it during startup and running modes. The ASD Relay relies upon throughput current that is calculated and determined within the vehicle's computer. While the vehicle's computer relies upon the sensors you mentioned , it must receive signals within parameters , to further pass that information (or current values) onto such things as the ASD Relay. It is best to begin at the battery terminals , because - all determinations of the electrical system rely upon the proper initial current coming from the battery. Then the power cable that goes directly to the PDC must be rust free and secure. While the PDC relays all rely upon that red cable that connects the entire PDC block terminals inclusively. This cable , could also cause the ASD Relay to malfunction , or trigger. In other words , the proper current must be received at all relays , for the system to function normally. Basically , power is fed to the relays , while the computer measures if the values are correct. If the values are low , high or not within prescribed parameters , the ASD Relay disconnects. Then no power goes anywhere. This works in conjuction with the security key feature , where - if an unauthorized key is inserted into the ignition that works , the engine will start , but will shut down after 2 minutes , because the key chip signal was not recieved (as a verified key) , it is determined as an "unverified key". This is a security / anti theft feature.
If you read the post above yours , you will find that I am offering a complete and precise Service Manual for the 300M at no cost. All you have to do is send me the address where you want to have the disk mailed to , and return the cost of postage and materials to me to my address. More information is available to those who provide an address and are serious about having a full featured and authentic Chrysler Service Technician Manual - that explains everything from a manufacturer to dealership technician point of view. The manuals are 10,000+ pages in length , and come on 1 disk (fully intuitive - clickable , in PDF format).
#178 of 195 Re: 1999 300m wont start [pitmanoeuvre]
Feb 06, 2013 (10:39 pm)
I have checked the pressure release valve located on the fuel rail and upon turning the key forward fuel will squirt all the way out of the engine compartment. This, to me, rules out a fuel related issue.