Last post on Mar 25, 2012 at 9:14 AM
You are in the Toyota Camry
What is this discussion about?
Toyota Camry, Suspension, Sedan
#116 of 146 Re: 2007 Camry--Leaking Struts [busterbunny]
Dec 19, 2009 (11:00 pm)
I just wanted to re-iterate on something here regarding the 2010 Camry.
I ended up just recently "leasing" a brand new 2010 Toyota Camry LE 2.5L automatic for 3 years and for 18,000 miles per year. The ONLY reason why I decided to do this is because I used to own a 1997 Toyota Camry 2.5L CE 5 speed manual and that particular car never gave me any mechanical problems. The ONLY 2 problems that I encountered during the 3 year and 52,000 mile owernership with my 97' Camry was that the rubber gaskets around all the window moldings on all 4 doors shrunk into the door frames. ALSO, the front end was making a "clunking" noise when I first bought the car. I left the rubber around the window molding frames "as is" and accepted the window molding flaw.
But the entire front end was replaced when the car had under 3,000 miles on it and the clunking noise went away. The origin of the clunking noise was from a loose flat metal washer that was located on top of the shock towers in the engine bay.
Again, the problem with the rubber gaskets around door window molding frames shrinking into the door frame was due to poor fit and finish because the car was NOT built 100% in Japan. It was built in Kentucky just like my current 2010 Camry LE. Other than that, I never encountered and other problems with my 97' Camry and the engine and transmission were flawless thru-out the 3 years that I owned it.
Now getting back to my current 2010 Camry LE which I just leased. The ONLY reason why I leased a 2010 Camry LE was because I wanted a decent point A to point B car and because I am NOT the type of person who wants to make the astronomical $250, $300+ and $400+ a month car payments for a vehicle. It aint worth it for a piece of metal that depreciates 50% and that will look beat and worn after 3 years of continuous everyday usage. I also decided on picking the Camry LE as my vehicle because my other 1997 Camry CE 5 speed manual was a very relaible car and it didn't give me any mechanical issues during the 3 years which I owned it from 1997-2000.
Currently, I only put down a total of $2,800 (with the gap insurance included in the $2,800 down payment together with all the taxes, title, fees, ect.) and I was able to lease my new 2010 Camry LE for ONLY $156.01 per month and am allowed to put 18,000 miles per year on it with a total of 54,000 miles in 3 years. I just couldn't pass up such a good deal and that's why I decided to stick with the new 2010 Camry LE.
I am hoping that I will not encounter any quality or mechanical issues with this car and that I will have a trouble-free 3 years/54,000 miles of ownership with my newly leased 2010 Camry LE. I am hoping that Toyota has resolved the leaking strut problem on the newer 2010 Camry vehicles.
I still wish that Toyota built all of their Camry vehicles 100% in Japan. I believe that cars built 100% in Japan are better built and that they use better quality materials on 100% Japanese built cars. The American built Camry is currently missing some of the quality that a Japanese car which is built 100% in Japan has. Japanese cars like the Camry which are built here in America just do NOT "cut the cake" and they do NOT have the same quality build standards that a 100% "made in Japan" Japanese built car has. That's why Toyota is having so many fit and finish and so many mechanical issues with their American built vehicles. The quality standards are much lower on all the vehicles that Toyota manufactures here in the U.S..
Let's face it, Americans do not and will never be able to meet the very strict Japanese quality and building standards on any of their Japanese brand name vehicles that they build here in the U.S.. It has never happened with the Camry and it will also never happen with any other American built Toyota as long as Toyota builds all their vehicles here in the United States and not in Japan.
I look at it this way with this type of logic:
If we Americans wanted to buy a lower quality vehicle that's built here in the U.S, we could always buy any American brand name car. Why buy a Japanese car that's built here in the U.S. if the Japanese car is going to have quality build issues and mechanical issues with it if you know what I mean? In other words, what good is it buying a Japanese brand name car that's built here in the U.S. that's got quality and mechanical issues when one could always buy an American brand name car with the same quality and mechanical issues? Why would I want to spend the "extra" money for a "cheaply built" American built Japanese brand name car when I can always spend "LESS" money and buy an American built American brand name car for much LESS money? I think that Toyota just like a lot of the other Japanese brand name auto manufacturers have gained a lot of loyal customers due to the fact that they once all build excellent quality cars in the past 30 years. But what a lot of people still do NOT realize is that the quality has gone down with a lot of the Japanese auto manufacturers. At least with a lot of the cars which they build here in the United States right now. Toyota needs to increase their quality standards in manufacturing and materials here in the U.S. to the same quality standards as they currently have in Japan. If they are unable to do this then Toyota needs to STOP building their cars here in the U.S. and they need to revert all of their automobile production back to Japan where the quality in manufacturing and materials is top notch. PERIOD!
#117 of 146 Re: 2007 Camry--Leaking Struts [gtgtcobra]
by MrShift@Edmunds HOST
Dec 20, 2009 (8:27 am)
That's a great lease in terms of mileage (the usual stumbling block for most leasees) and I don't mean to nitpick, but in fact your payments are $233 a month because of your upfront money. Still you can't beat that mileage allowance.
#118 of 146 Re: 2007 Camry--Leaking Struts [Mr_Shiftright]
Dec 20, 2009 (4:06 pm)
"That's a great lease in terms of mileage (the usual stumbling block for most leasees) and I don't mean to nitpick, but in fact your payments are $233 a month because of your upfront money. Still you can't beat that mileage allowance."
Yes, you are very right about the mileage allowance. Initially, in the beginning of the lease deal, I "demanded" that my payment be "no more" than $150.00 per month "with" taxes included with ONLY a $1,000.00 down payment and "with" 18,000 miles a year. The dealership declined my offer and I then increased my down payment to a $1,500.00 down payment and still demanded the same exact $150.00 monthly payments with tax included.
The dealership then was able to meet me at a payment of $169.00 per month with all the taxes included with 18,000 miles a year and with ALSO a FREE REMOTE START. I closed the deal at the $169.00 per month payment, but my wife wanted to put $500.00 MORE down and when we did that the payment went down to $156.01 per month.
I also had to pay an extra $185.00 for the car which I selected from the lot because it had $185.00 more in options in it which wasn't a big deal to me. Then I ALSO paid the GAP INSURANCE up front too which was $595.00 for the entire 3 years of the lease.
So, the $185.00 added difference in the price of the car that I chose from the dealer's lot, plus the added $595.00 GAP INSURANCE plus the $2,020.00 that I put down for the car came out to a total of $2,800.00......($185.00 + $595.00 + $2,020.00 = $2,800.00).
I also think that I got an excellent deal too.
I'm hoping to work out a similar deal just like this one again when my lease is up in 3 years when I am ready to lease another Toyota Camry again.
#119 of 146 Re: 2007 Camry--Leaking Struts [gtgtcobra]
Dec 20, 2009 (5:21 pm)
Disagree about USA build quality. I have had worse experience with Japan built cars. My experience is that USA and Canadian built Toyotas have gone over 100,000 miles with no problems. The Japan-built did too, but it had about three squeaks and rattles that had to be fixed (fortunately under warranty). But is it really the build quality? No!
I said the same thing over in the Prius vs. Camry forum. What matters the most is the design of the car. If the design is good, then the assembly will be easy, and the chance of errors is much less. Also, the design also includes the parts and their specs, and if this is good, then you will not have any problems, no matter where they are built. I know our USA workers can produce as good or better as any country, but you have to start with a good design, and that includes all the components. A bad component can be built OK, but if it is with sub par materials (per the design specs) or if it is not easy to assemble, then the chances of a problem go up dramatically. The factory, no matter where it is, can only produce a car as good as the engineering was. I had more problems with a Japan Rav than my USA/Canadian Toyotas - why? Some BAD engineering, not bad Japan assembly.
Sorry, I have been in manufacturing since I finished college, and my experience tells me that it is the DESIGN, not the assembly.
#120 of 146 Re: 2007 Camry--Leaking Struts [mcdawgg]
Dec 20, 2009 (6:10 pm)
I made this same exact post in the Prius versus Camry Forum, but since we are both debating about the same issue regarding Toyota build quality, I thought that I would also include the same post that I made in the Prius versus Camry Forum in here too. Maybe you or someone else in here can enlighten me about this topic.
I can tell you one thing. My family currently owns a 98 Camry and I used to own a 97 Camry CE. I sold my 97 Camry back in 2000, but mine ALSO had fit and finish and quality issues. My family still owns the 98 Camry and it too has fit and finish issues and rattles and it only has 54,000 original miles on it. Both of these vehicles were built here in the USA in Kentucky. Before my family owned the 98 Camry, they owned a 1982 Toyota Celica that was purchased brand new which was 100% built in Japan. The 100% Japanese built 1982 Celica was an excellent car. We never had any fit and finish or any quality problems with the Celica during the entire 16 years that we owned it. It had over 170,000+ miles before we gave it away to another member of our family. They owned it and drove it for another 2 years until it was 19 years old and they traded it in for another vehicle. When they traded it in the 1982 Celica was still driveable and it had over 180,000+ miles on it. The only thing wrong with the car was that it had rust on the lower panels and on the floor boards from all the salt and from the 19 winters that it went thru up here in the northeast. Other than that, everything on the vehicle was working and the car was running like brand new.
But on the other hand, the 1998 Camry that my family still drives and owns has all sorts of rattling and fit and finish issues that the 1982 Celica didn't have. Can you tell me WHY that is so?
WHY didn't the 1982 Celica have any fit and finish and quality issues during the entire 19 years of ownership? And WHY does the 1998 Camry have fit and finish and quality issues? And WHY did my 1997 Camry also have fit and finish and quality issues too? Is it because maybe when they were built here in the USA in Kentucky that the manufacturing process or the materials were not up to par like the materials and like the manufacturing process that they use in Japan for the same exact same vehicles? There HAS to be a legitimate reason WHY this occurs. There is NO WAY that American built Toyotas are better or equal quality as the Toyotas that are 100% built in Japan. That's an big overstatement. American built Toyotas are not as well built and are not as good quality as the ones that are built 100% in Japan. There is something that is NOT done here with the American built Toyota vehicles that are done with the ones that are built 100% in Japan. What it is I don't know? I am hoping that someone can chime in on this issue. What is the difference between a 100% Japanese built Toyota and a 100% American built Toyota? If we can find this out then we will also find out WHY the American built Toyota vehicles lack the quality that the Japanese built ones have. Maybe someone in here knows the answer to this.
#121 of 146 Re: 2007 Camry--Leaking Struts [gtgtcobra]
by MrShift@Edmunds HOST
Dec 20, 2009 (9:15 pm)
Well anecdotal evidence is good for the person who experiences it, but it's not necessarily evidence that will work as "proof". After all, each of us is only a database of 1.
I agree, it's how the car is engineered that determines its success in the field. Fit and finish issues are easily addressed and it is the management, not the workers, that create or destroy quality control. I mean, you'd think German workers would be the best in the world, being well paid and well educated, but they don't make the most reliable cars, and the reason is because German management and German engineering doesn't have a handle on it yet.
#122 of 146 Re: 98 Toyota Camry Rear Suspension Rattle. [duck928]
Jan 08, 2010 (6:00 pm)
Had the same problem. Toyota garage put new bushings in rear sway bars for $130 and noise was gone.
#123 of 146 2009 Camry Suspension Problems
Jul 06, 2010 (8:36 am)
I am having some problems with my 2009 Camry from the day I purchased it two years ago. I live in Canada, and I wanted to know if anyone is having the same problems.
1. My shocks are leaking... all four
2. When I go over a speed bump or pot hole I hear a clunking noise and a weird sound from the front.
3. My engine between 40 and 60 struggles to change gears.
4. At about 85, 95, and 110, I get this vibration from the frond end and sometimes the car jumps to the right or left when I hit a bump at high speeds. I have almost gotten into several accidents.
I am told my Toyota Canada and the dealership there is nothing wrong with my car. The leaking shocks are normal on Camrys. The vibration problem they have noticed also but tells me that it is the road conditions, but when I change speeds to 115 or 90 or 89 km the vibrations goes away on the same road. The engine problem they have stated that it is the overdrive that is kicking in, but I know overdrive does not kick in until after 75 km.
The first dealership where I purchased my car, after I complained several times and yelled at them the last time, they had their lawyers send me a letter that I am no longer welcomed at that dealership and must take my business elsewhere. This is how Toyota Canada and the dealerships treat customers.
#124 of 146 Re: 2009 Camry Suspension Problems [pissoffcamown]
Jul 06, 2010 (9:11 pm)
Leaking shocks are not normal, and could be the cause of #2 and #4 problems, also causing alignment problems which lead to tire wear and balance problems. You indicate the problems existed 'from the day you purchased it'. If your shocks were leaking since day 1, the dealership would obviously had replaced them as clearly defective. You don't indicate your mileage, and we don't know your driving style or typical roads in your area.....to determine the "cause", or "when" the shocks started going bad. You also don't explain the logic and rationale that the dealership has given you why they won't cover the repair. So we really don't have a whole lot of info to evaluate your situation.
I have an 07 with almost 60K miles now, and the suspension is still very tight, tracks straight, and no leaks anywhere. But with any mechanical conglomerate of parts, I'm sure someone has had a defective shock. How you could end up with four would on the surface indicate that it is something that you have done....or....the shock manufacturer has a MAJOR problem that would effect more than you. The odds of you getting 'all four' defective shocks, is a low probability.
If you have a legitimate low mileage warranty concern, escalate up the Toyota chain. Otherwise, go put a new set of struts on the vehicle, have it aligned, have the tires rebalanced, and replace the tire if it can't be balanced or is out of round. Your vehicle is not going to get better sitting in your driveway.
If the strut breaks, you run the risk of a catastrophic accident as the wheel breaks out from under the car as you are driving down the road. You risk serious injury, to you or others. You knowing this risk of failed parts, failing to repair your vehicle and continuing to drive on it, would put you legally at risk as well.
Go repair your vehicle and move on with life.
#125 of 146 Re: 2009 Camry Suspension Problems [pissoffcamown]
Oct 15, 2010 (5:58 pm)
I have a 2009 Camry with 12k miles and I have the exact same issue that you mentioned in #2 above. At low speeds, especially when turning into driveways, I hear a loud clunking noise from the back end of the car.
I took it to the dealer and they "couldn't replicate" the problem and refused to investigate it further. I did a quick visual inspection and everything appears to be firmly attached, but I'm far from an expert in suspensions. I'm planning to bring it back in and take the Toyota technician for a ride so that I can replicate the problem for him.
Just wondering if anyone else is coming across this issue.