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Hybrid Vehicles Electric Vehicles Electric Vehicle Pros & Cons
1560 messages, Last post on Apr 28, 2008 at 11:55 AM
You are in the Electric Vehicles Forum. Your Host is pf_flyer
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Replying to: gagrice (Apr 07, 2008 8:59 pm)
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Replying to: reddroverr (Apr 11, 2008 2:50 pm)
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Replying to: plekto (Apr 11, 2008 3:30 pm) According to this: http://www.efcf.com/reports/E14.pdf a 300 L (that is about 80 gallons) tank of compressed air contains only 51 MJ of energy. For comparison a single gallon of gas contains 121 MJ. So even if it is more efficient, how far am I going to get with even 80 gallons of air in a real car? |
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Replying to: jeffyscott (Apr 12, 2008 4:36 am) Note - the air car is also several hundred lbs lighter than the IC design as most of what's under a typical car's hood is gone. So: Two tanks, 50-60MJ total useable. More if you have any sort of regenerative system or solar panels or whatnot to run the on-board compressor. So figuring in those factors, the efficiency may be closer to 50%. Gasoline, 121MJ per gallon, about 30MJ useable. So roughly the range of 2 gallons of gas. Maybe 90-100 miles in actual driving. Not great for long-distance, but good enough for daily commuting and whatnot. Certainly a viable alternative to electric vehicles, as there would be no costly batteries to replace. People complain that it moves the pollution elsewhere, and that the compressors are not efficient, but when you add in the cost of making the batteries or obtaining and refining the oil, it's a clear win-win situation for this technology. We will eventually run out of oil and can't make enough biofuel anyways, so eventually it's going to be either steam, air, or electric.(SteamPunk fans rejoice!) http://auto.howstuffworks.com/air-car1.htm Note the three minute high pressure charge. This is comparable to gasoline. Filling stations can easily add a large air tank and a compressor. Much easier than silly fuel cell or battery swapping proposals. They claim 120 miles range as well, which is moderately close considering typical manufacturer hype, to my napkin-math.  It's a short-range city commuter. And you'd just plug it in once you get home to fill it up for the next day. Much safer as well than CNG, which requires an expensive filling device and an inspection from the utility company. And a garage. Since the compressor is on the vehicle, you would plug it in at work, even, or in a typical parking garage/space.
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Replying to: plekto (Apr 14, 2008 2:42 pm) Pop Mech sums it up..."We'll believe it when we drive it" Zero Pollution Motors (ZPM) confirmed to PopularMechanics.com on Thursday that it expects to produce the world’s first air-powered car for the United States by late 2009 or early 2010. As the U.S. licensee for Luxembourg-based MDI, which developed the Air Car as a compression-based alternative to the internal combustion engine, ZPM has attained rights to build the first of several modular plants, which are likely to begin manufacturing in the Northeast and grow for regional production around the country, at a clip of up to 10,000 Air Cars per year. And while ZPM is also licensed to build MDI’s two-seater OneCAT economy model (the one headed for India) and three-seat MiniCAT (like a SmartForTwo without the gas), the New Paltz, N.Y., startup is aiming bigger: Company officials want to make the first air-powered car to hit U.S. roads a $17,800, 75-hp equivalent, six-seat modified version of MDI’s CityCAT (pictured above) that, thanks to an even more radical engine, is said to travel as far as 1000 miles at up to 96 mph with each tiny fill-up. http://www.popularmechanics.com/automotive/new_cars/4251491.html?series=19 |
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Replying to: plekto (Apr 14, 2008 2:42 pm) I agree that this battery swapping idea doesn't make much sense. However there are batteries being developed that will allow an 85% charge in under 10 minutes with a special charging station. Given the early reviews on Honda's FCX Clarity I do believe that fuel cell vehicles have some potential, albeit in the distant future. It would be interesting to see them crash test one of these compressed air vehicles and see what happens should a full tank rupture. Obviously it wouldn't catch on fire but that doesn't mean there wouldn't be an explosion.
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Replying to: tpe (Apr 17, 2008 5:35 am) But MDI really is trying to make this work. They already sell the vehicles in France. They actually have the cars on the road, unlike Zap and the rest. The technology is simple, straightforward, and 100% off the shelf/ready to go. I'd consider them to be more akin to Tesla Motors. Small, but a real company. Of course, their design is far from optimal. That goes to the rotary air engine that guy in Australia made. Why he can't put that in a car I just don't know. |
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Replying to: tpe (Apr 07, 2008 11:43 am)
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Replying to: thaddock (Apr 25, 2008 6:38 pm) Good point. That is just about the epitome of hypocrisy. Don't build that coal fired plant in my back yard. But if you build one we will buy the electricity. We are governed by possibly the worst legislature and governor the USA has ever witnessed. What can we expect when our attorney general is named Moonbeam? |
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Replying to: thaddock (Apr 25, 2008 6:38 pm) The coal industry is obviously opposed to CA's mandate and has even questioned the legality of it. Saying that it might be a violation of interstate commerce laws. |
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