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Sedans Mainstream Large Sedans Comparison
6844 messages, Last post on Mar 23, 2009 at 12:32 PM
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Replying to: brucelinc (Jun 03, 2008 5:07 am) trips on two-lane roads at lower speeds and gotten 33-34 MPG. On her daily commute of 50/50 city and freeway, grocery shopping, etc. it averages around 24-25 MPG. The tall overdrive in 6th gear really helps fuel economy on the highway. The engine is powerful enough to prevent unwanted downshifts on hills, too" "The Taurus has a 3.16 axle ratio and a .74 OD for a final drive of 2.34. At 75 MPH, it is turning around 2000 RPM"  Using your figures which BTW I am unable to verify for a 2008 Taurus, we find that with the standard tire, a Continental ContiTouringContact CT95, size 215/60TR17 turns 767 revs per mile. 3.16 X 0.74 X 767 equals 1794 revs per mile at 60 mph. Indeed, rather 'tall' gearing. 1794 divided by 60 equals 29.89 revs per one mph. Taking that further, we find that: 75 mph will be 2241 RPM 80 mph will be 2391 RPM I do not see how this vehicle turning those revs will achieve those high average miles-per-gallon figures stated at those speeds.
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Replying to: jaymagic (Jun 03, 2008 12:22 pm) Avalon is the same, but my wife's 5 year old Altima OTH does 'adjust up'. One other thing that I'd like to see changed on the Avalon, the 'average MPG' resets itself every time you fill up and sometimes will even reset itself when it 'thinks' it's getting filled up - gas sloshing around in the tank or parking on a slope. Makes it impossible to keep track of FE on a long multiple fill-up trip - unless you do it manually. Have found the computer FE to generally be closer than the calculated method, especially if I'm not the one 'breaking the rules' and filling the gas up the filler neck. |
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Replying to: captain2 (Jun 03, 2008 12:36 pm) Different tuning and almost 40 extra hp (268 vs 306). The FSE is tuned for performance driving and FE is tuned for smoothness and efficiency. why wouldn't Toyota put the DI in the Avalon and increase the FE advantage it already has in this class? Cost my captain, cost!! 'double-Vanos' I think double VANOS is about the intake valves like Honda's i-VTEC and Toyota's i VVT. I was talking about the fuel injecting technology, those two are totally different animals. Actually the DI technology is nothing new, it has been used on diesel engines since like forever, it has been used on gasoline engines earlier too but only becomes popular recently. However, so far I don't know what other engine(s) uses the duel injection technology like Toyota did with the 2GR-FSE.
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Replying to: snaglepus (Jun 03, 2008 12:38 pm) 80 mph will be 2391 RPM now we are getting a bit more technical aren't we? These numbers BTW almost identical to what I see in my Avalon BTW and what I would guess is very typical for these drivetrains.Had a hard time with 80mph at 2000 rpm! |
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Replying to: louiswei (Jun 03, 2008 12:47 pm) I'm sure it is not free - however I'm sure you've probably read the articles about the development of the 2GR and also know that Toyota is saving literally billions of dollars making a far better engine then before. If I remember right something to the tune of a grand saved PER ENGINE - you wouldn't think a set of Nippondenso injectors would even approach that?
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Replying to: captain2 (Jun 03, 2008 1:06 pm) The primary disadvantages of direct injection engines are complexity and cost. Direct injection systems are more expensive to build because their components must be more rugged -- they handle fuel at significantly higher pressures than indirect injection systems and the injectors themselves must be able to withstand the heat and pressure of combustion inside the cylinder. Source: Direct Fuel Injection Looks like it's not just a set of Nippondenso injectors... 
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Replying to: carolinabob (Jun 03, 2008 4:46 am) if it makes you feel any better - Gulf States down here in Texas does the same thing (GST and SET are the only 2 independent Toyota distributors left apparently) - and it STILL is almost impossible to find an Avalon down here without that kinda extra markup in it and that's after the car has been available for more than 3 years. A testament to how well the car sells perhaps but a definite disadvantage when dealing with those that are so conscious of initial prices. |
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Replying to: captain2 (Jun 03, 2008 12:36 pm) Perhaps you should create a 2GR Forum. |
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Replying to: louiswei (Jun 03, 2008 1:13 pm) yep from the sound of this article its a set of really high quality injectors - and a few extra lines in a computer program. Still not convinced that DI doesn't cost a bit of gas though - understanding of course that a IS350 better damn well be geared differently than a 'mere' Avalon. One of these cars can do so much more than the other , can't it? 
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Replying to: captain2 (Jun 03, 2008 12:36 pm) The BMW 335i has a 3.0L engine and has 300 lbs/ft of torque  1400 rpm while the Lexus 3.5L has 2774800 rpm. Plus, the BMW 335i is under-rated with having 300HP after some have found out after taking the car to a dyno where it was rated at 300 RWHP.
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