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Mainstream Large Sedans Comparison

6844 messages,  Last post on Mar 23, 2009 at 12:32 PM

You are in the Sedans Forum. Your Hosts are pat & karens

What is this discussion about? Buick Lucerne, Chevrolet Impala, Dodge Charger, Ford Taurus, Hyundai Azera, Toyota Avalon, Nissan Maxima, Pontiac G8, Car Comparisons, Sedan


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#5987 of 6844
Re: 2009 Maxima [captain2] by tjc78
Mar 25, 2008 (6:51 am)
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Replying to: captain2 (Mar 25, 2008 5:49 am)

This is the same thing that happened with the 300C, you suppose that Chrysler having a bit more trouble selling them now than they did a few years back?
 
Considering things like lifetime powertrain warranties, 0% financing and rebates....I think you know the answer to that
 
As for the (V8) G8, I don't think it will never be a mainstream vehicle, so resale may not be as horrid as most V8 domestics. Only time will tell. If GM is planning on using this platform elsewhere in the line (i.e. Lucerne / Impala) that could change. What I wouldn't mind seeing is the direct injection 3.6 (CTS) as the base engine for the rumoured RWD Lucerne.
#5988 of 6844
Re: Why speed limiters? [alexstore] by tonycd
Mar 25, 2008 (8:34 am)
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Replying to: alexstore (Jun 19, 2007 7:11 am)

Don't know how much this matters to the Drive Safely finger-wagging lecture series going on here, but I believe the reason carmakers went to speed limiters was to avoid liability concerns because of the car being able to outrun the speed rating of the tires.
 
FWIW.
#5989 of 6844
Re: 2009 Maxima [tjc78] by captain2
Mar 26, 2008 (10:00 am)
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Replying to: tjc78 (Mar 25, 2008 4:28 am)

a 2008 Grand Marquis has a $5500 rebate
which brings up an interesting question - if they can't sell these overweight gas hoggish V8s in something as relatively cheap as the GMarquis, or FTM something not so cheap like the 300C, then why should General Motors expect the G8 to sell well or Hyundai the Genesis etc. etc. Maybe the car buying public is a little more sensitive to things like FE than I give them credit for?
#5990 of 6844
Re: 2009 Maxima [captain2] by scwmcan
Mar 26, 2008 (10:07 am)
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Replying to: captain2 (Mar 26, 2008 10:00 am)

The grand marquis may have something to do with the fact that it hasn't been significantly updated or changed in a decade or more, people just don't see it as a car they want regardless of the fuel economy. I think GM and hyundai aren't expecting too much out of the cars, I don't know about hyundai's goals but GM only wants to sell 40,000 cars this year, shouldn't be too hard.
Scott
#5991 of 6844
Re: 2009 Maxima [captain2] by allmet33
Mar 26, 2008 (10:13 am)
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Replying to: captain2 (Mar 26, 2008 10:00 am)

It's called driving excitement, neither of which the G-Marquis or the 300 offer.
 
However...I really don't see the V-8 versions of the G8 and Genesis as being top sellers period. As stated in a posted previously, the V-6 variants will be the mass sellers.
 
The higer gas prices creep, the car buying public will be extremely sensitive to FE. Instead of comparing Mainstream Large Sedans, we'll be comparing mopeds and bicycles here!!!
#5992 of 6844
Re: 2009 Maxima [scwmcan] by captain2
Mar 26, 2008 (10:23 am)
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Replying to: scwmcan (Mar 26, 2008 10:07 am)

Scott - I would guess that there are enough HP addicts out there to sell 40k vehicles per year and the G8 even with the V6 doesn't figure to offer anything remarkable FE wise. Certainly the old standby RWD solid rear axle 'Detroit' sedan is older than Methusa - but the GM is a 'lot of car' for the money. Is it the fact that it is such an ancient lumbering design or is it the crappy FE that makes it such a tough sale?
#5993 of 6844
Re: 2009 Maxima [allmet33] by captain2
Mar 26, 2008 (10:29 am)
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Replying to: allmet33 (Mar 26, 2008 10:13 am)

In this group those V6 variants you are talking about don't project to do very well at the gas pump either. Both the Hyundai 3.8 and the GM 3.6 have shown to be quite capable of putting out 300hp or so - but neither engine has been particularily good on gas in lighter cars.
Your comment about mopeds etc. would obviously then make the diesel (and hybrid) an obvious 'solution' if we want to keep our big cars, although I'm afraid that these 6 second excursions to 60mph will be a thing of the past
#5994 of 6844
Re: 2009 Maxima [captain2] by scwmcan
Mar 26, 2008 (10:34 am)
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Replying to: captain2 (Mar 26, 2008 10:23 am)

Sorry that's what I was trying to say, that the ancient design of the grand marquis was the problem it may be " a lot" of car for the money, but it severely lacking in features, refinement, comfort, powers etc compared to almost any other car in it's segment. General Motors should have no trouble selling 40,000 G8's but trying to get a lot more than that and the poor FE (as you say even the v6) might begin to hurt sales but no more than other similarly inefficient large sedans, I think it has been noted that even the avalon doesn't get that much better milage (by the EPA at least). As I have no idea what Hyundai's goals are for the genesis I can't say wether they are being realistic or not, but I have a feeling they aren't expecting to sell 2 or 3 hundred thousand of them so it probably won't be a problem to meet their sales goals.
I wouldn't think that anyone would consider any of the large cars to be really fuel efficient anyway, but yes 1 or 2 MPG might make a difference to some people (it would to me but I wouldn't be looking at this segment at the moment anyway, I just like to see what is going on in it).
Scott
#5995 of 6844
Re: 2009 Maxima [captain2] by allmet33
Mar 26, 2008 (10:35 am)
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Replying to: captain2 (Mar 26, 2008 10:29 am)

Yes, but when one is shelling out $4+/gallon, 1,2 or even a 3 mpg difference will mean the world. So if the V-8 version is getting 16/25 and the V-6 variant is getting 18/28...and the buyer can get the car optioned out exactly the same beyond the engine...I bet they'd opt for the V-6 version.
 
Have you seen the price of diesel lately??? Out here in the DC area, its running higher than premium gas now. Last I looked, it's already hitting folks for $3.98/gal. as opposed to the $3.19/gal. for regular.
 
Trust me...I haven't been making any forays into speeds above 80 lately.
#5996 of 6844
Re: 2009 Maxima [captain2] by tjc78
Mar 26, 2008 (11:19 am)
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Replying to: captain2 (Mar 26, 2008 10:00 am)

Maybe the car buying public is a little more sensitive to things like FE than I give them credit for?
 
I think its an increasing issue especially for people that drive 40 and 50 miles to work. Gas adds up really quickly. IMO a car like the G8 is strictly for as you call it HP addicts and those who wish they still had their Chevelle 454 big block, T/A etc.

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