Last post on Jul 16, 2012 at 7:08 AM
You are in the Sedans
What is this discussion about?
Buick Lucerne, Chevrolet Impala, Dodge Charger, Ford Taurus, Hyundai Azera, Toyota Avalon, Nissan Maxima, Pontiac G8, Car Comparisons, Sedan
#5227 of 6854 Re: 2009 maxima [priggly]
Feb 19, 2008 (9:11 am)
Further, in what way does the Polk award mean nothing? Just how is it "obviously contrived and meaningless?"
ANY AWARD to ANYBODY that is provided by a profit making organization MUST be regarded with a great deal skepticism - especially obvious when it says something equally nebulous like 'owner loyalty award' . Why don't you tell me what that exactly means because it certainly has nothing to do with the quality of automobiles? I can't draw a clearer picture.
Like CR who, of course, are promulgating their publication out of the goodness of their hearts. LOL
OK then why don't you tell me about what possible benefit CR would have to diss the Impala ( or anybody or anything else) .? CR financial statements are all available on line BTW, if you can read one you will know exactly where the money comes from (and where the money they make goes) .
And exactly in what way is the V-8 'rumble" in the SS not "properly applied?"
I guess you haven' really been following this thread, have you? The Impala should be a better car if GM can figure out a way to get enough Holden production in Australia so that Chevy can do the same thing that Pontiac is doing with the GP, putting it out of its misery and selling instead a more proper G8 GT. The GP BTW took a more aggressive approach (tire sizing) to torque steer control than the ostensibly similar Impala - typical GM 'cheap fix' but even that would indicate that even GM knows its a problem, because the bean counters are not going to allow them to be spending the money they don't have, needlessly....
Maybe someday the Impala will sell to somebody other than the rental car companies and corporations, GM will make some money on it, and improve it as it deserves. It is an icon of what the 'American' car is - even if it isn't really an American car.
#5228 of 6854 Re: 2009 maxima [louiswei]
Feb 19, 2008 (9:48 am)
Trust me...if Honda can make the Accord larger and maintain it's FE ratings...sales won't be hurt at all. What does the Avalon have to do with any of this?
Once again, if you're basing a 300+ hp FWD as a "sport sedan" then no, it's not gonna work...as I've already said a few times already. However...as a touring sedan...it would work just fine.
Just get over the fact that you've been proven wrong. Sheesh!
#5229 of 6854 Re: 2009 maxima [louiswei]
Feb 19, 2008 (9:52 am)
This is one issue I would have to agree with you on. Especially the 4-spd tranny!!!
#5230 of 6854 Big brother...meets lil brother
Feb 19, 2008 (9:58 am)
The 2009 Sonata has been massaged a bit on the outside. The hard lines have given way to a few curves...now it will truly look like a smaller Azera!!!
#5231 of 6854 Re: 2009 maxima [allmet33]
Feb 19, 2008 (10:02 am)
That's where you were mistaken. Not everyone wants a larger sedan, why the midsize sedan segment is bigger than the large sedan segment is because to many people, Camcordimas are just about the right size for their family hauling needs without being too oversized like cars in this group. By moving Accord upmarket that means the price has to increase as well. You know honest think when Accords are starting out at $26k and topping out at $36k it'll retain the current sales figure?
What does the Avalon have to do with this? Because if Accord is moving upmarket its main competitor will the be Avalon. Do you think if that's the case Accord will be able to out-sell Avalon 3 to 1?
Is the Impala SS a touring sedan? Will Nissan makes the next Maxima a touring sedan? Like I said, Nissan will not be able to out-Toyota Toyota so the Maxima is bound to be a failure if they are going to make it an Avalon wannabe. The only way the Maxima can be a success is to make it the sporty king of the segment, with that the FWD is just not going to work (I remember this is how we get into the 300hp+ FWD discussion).
So again, looks like it's someone else who has been proven wrong (as usual)...
#5232 of 6854 Re: 2009 maxima [louiswei]
Feb 19, 2008 (10:14 am)
Well...to a degree you're right, but also...wrong. There is a segment of folks that would buy a Honda if they offered a larger car. Those folks would be the ones with families and those that don't wanna buy an Odyssey. So...by moving the Accord up they can tap into sales that they are missing.
As far as the mid-size segment...moving the Civic up to that would take care of that as well. The Accord would hold it's own against the Avalon, simply by it's solid following.
I would tout the Impala SS as a touring sedan more so than a sports sedan...that's MY opinion.
How am I proven wrong when a 300+ hp FWD vehicle exists???
#5233 of 6854 AWD 4 Hyundai???
Feb 19, 2008 (10:23 am)
Looks like Genesis, Azera and possibly the Sonata might benefit. I certainly see the biggest benefit would be to the Genesis. A RWD based AWD system would prove pretty nice and put it up there with the GS in terms of handling capabilities in incliment weather.
Hyundai & Kia Planning AWD cars
#5234 of 6854 Re: 2009 maxima [allmet33]
Feb 19, 2008 (10:25 am)
How large is that segment? 1000 people a month? Trust me, now a days if people really want a dedicated people hauler they'll go with a crossover or minivan and Honda happened to have both of the segments covered well with the Pilot and Odyssey. The family sedan segment currently is the hottest for a reason, cars in that groups offer enough space, good power (V6s), decent fuel economy (I4s) without being too oversized and break the bank.
Again, you haven't answer my question. Do you honestly think Accord will retain it's current sales figure when it goes from $26k to $36k?
If Honda moves the Civic upmarket then who's going to fill the compact sedan segment (the next hottest thing). Fit you say, okay, then who's going to fill the sub-compact segment (the fast growing segment)? So either way Honda will need a new model, if that's the case why not leave everyone in their comfort zone and if Honda really wants a large sedan (which I doubt it) then they can add a model at the top.
You are proven wrong that a FWD 300hp+ Maxima is not a good idea (which is the origin of this whole discussion).
#5235 of 6854 Re: 2009 maxima [louiswei]
Feb 19, 2008 (10:30 am)
Not true...I'll take a large sedan over a mini-van, cross over or SUV.
With all the cars that Honda has...they can make it work...trust me.
Ahhhhhhhhhhhh...how am I proven wrong about a 300+ hp Max? Does one exist? Has one been tried? Have you driven one to know? Oh...didn't think so. NEXT!!!
#5236 of 6854 Re: 2009 maxima [allmet33]
Feb 19, 2008 (10:45 am)
"There is a segment of folks that would buy a Honda if they offered a larger car"
Add me to that list, I have always wanted Honda to offer a competitor to the Avalon.
P.S. been away on business and enjoyed catching up on this board. You guys have been busy. I was driving a Chevy Impala as a rental..... let's just say I was happy to get back into my Av