Last post on Jul 16, 2012 at 7:08 AM
You are in the Sedans
What is this discussion about?
Buick Lucerne, Chevrolet Impala, Dodge Charger, Ford Taurus, Hyundai Azera, Toyota Avalon, Nissan Maxima, Pontiac G8, Car Comparisons, Sedan
#5178 of 6854 Re: 2009 maxima [allmet33]
Feb 15, 2008 (12:51 pm)
What I was trying to say is, at around 250hp, torque steer in a FWD car is already uncontrollable so nevertheless at over 300hp. I've never driven the current Maxima before but I heard it's a torque steer monster. However, I did test drive the 286hp TL-S once and even with the torque steer reduce mechanism that it deploys, the affect is still very obvious.
Sports sedan or not, with around 300hp, torque steer in a FWD Maxima will no doubt to be nasty.
So what if the Accord will eventually move into the large car segment but Honda will still slot it in the "family sedan segment" with the rest like Camry, Altima and Sonata. Actually according to EPA, the current Sonata is also a "large car", do you see Hyundai to market it against Avalon, Impala and Maxima?
Honda's mantra is the FE king but Nissan's mantra is "sporty" that's why I said there is no way Nissan can out-Toyota Toyota with the Maxima.
#5179 of 6854 Re: 2009 maxima [captain2]
Feb 15, 2008 (12:52 pm)
Captain...you're just too doggone funny!!! If a company designs an engine for that, it would be able to handle it. I may just do the supercharger when I start the mods on it. Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm....
I...my friend...was the one that just said just because it has 300 hp, doesn't make it a sports sedan.
#5180 of 6854 Re: 2009 maxima [captain2]
Feb 15, 2008 (12:56 pm)
Here's a test for allmet33 to conduct at his leisure...
Go test drive the following 3 cars with hands off the steering wheel and step hard on the gas padel. Make sure you are at an open area and no other cars around.
1. Your Azera
2. Nissan Maxima
3. Any 300hp+ RWD sedans like the IS350, 335i, G35 and etc...
Let us know afterward if you still think 300hp+ FWD car is a good idea.
#5181 of 6854 Re: 2009 maxima [louiswei]
Feb 15, 2008 (1:05 pm)
If torque steer is THAT much of an issue, then why even approach 300 hp with a FWD car?
However, the test you suggest is quite ridiculous...nobody, and I stress NOBODY should or would mash on the gas pedal of ANY car with their hands off the steering wheel.
I still think, with today's technology...a 300 hp FWD vehicle can work.
#5182 of 6854 Re: 2009 maxima [allmet33]
Feb 15, 2008 (1:28 pm)
I think that's exactly our point - and if that technology to cure the 'problem' involves some computer programs to limit throttle (as it does on the TL-S) or a computer program that shifts trannies to higher gears - then WHY BOTHER- make the car RWD in the first place and 'avoid' the issue altogether. The 2009 Maxima if it is going to have 300hp would therefore need to be a decontented M35 (a great car in its own right that sells in the 40s) and something that would sell like hotcakes in the 30s. You would have to wonder why would Nissan do that though, all they would be doing is robbing some higher profit Infiniti sales. The Infiniti Ms and Gs sell extremely well on their own and have no problem with residual values either.
#5183 of 6854 Re: 2009 maxima [captain2]
Feb 15, 2008 (1:37 pm)
If the desire is to make a "sports sedan" then I agree. However...highway cruisers and touring sedans could easily work.
You see...everything you're saying makes perfect sense if you're goal is maximum performance...and on that point, I do agree.
As far as Infiniti selling a stripped down M for the $30K's just to make up for Nissan dropping the Max...I don't see it happening.
#5184 of 6854 Re: 2009 maxima [allmet33]
Feb 15, 2008 (2:30 pm)
no actually I meant selling it as a Nissan not an Infiniti, the 'Nissan' name a bit of a different market perception and easier to sell IMO than a 290hp V6 Genesis. Sorry, the post was confusing
#5185 of 6854 Re: 2009 maxima [allmet33]
Feb 15, 2008 (4:38 pm)
The test is not ridiculous, granted that nobody would stomp the gas with hands off the steering wheel but the point of the test is to let you see the difference between the high horsepower FWD and RWD cars.
#5186 of 6854 2007 Hyundai Azera Long-Term Test Wrap Up
Feb 15, 2008 (4:41 pm)
This stat certainly surprised me but nevertheless attributed to the improvement of the brand:
Edmunds' TMV® calculator values the Azera at $21,838 after 18,530 miles. This equates to 27 percent depreciation from its original MSRP and ranks it just behind its competitors in resale worth.
Our Toyota Camry depreciated by a similar 26 percent margin at the conclusion of its long-term test, although it had an additional 3,000 miles on the odometer.
True Market Value at service end: $21,838
Depreciation: $7,932 or 27 percent of original MSRP
Final Odometer Reading: 18,530
#5187 of 6854 Re: 2009 maxima [allmet33]
Feb 16, 2008 (5:40 am)
I follow this column as a lurker and I don't want to debate "sport sedans" with anyone but you state "a 300 HP FWD vehicle can work." It certainly can, I drive one every day, Impala SS, and while I make absolutely no claims as to it being a "sports sedan", the torque steer is very manageable as long as you know its there.
I'm an old-timer, owned a '66 Chevy SS, 427 tri-power when it was brand new and many other big-blocks, the FWD is certainly different entirely in its handling characteristics but it is driveable and fast, would I go back to the sixties if I could? No way.