Last post on Jul 16, 2012 at 8:08 AM
You are in the Sedans
What is this discussion about?
Buick Lucerne, Chevrolet Impala, Dodge Charger, Ford Taurus, Hyundai Azera, Toyota Avalon, Nissan Maxima, Pontiac G8, Car Comparisons, Sedan
#13 of 6854 Check out these numbers...
Jul 25, 2006 (9:12 am)
2006 Chrysler 300 2.7L base/103 cu ft interior/24 cu ft luggage/MPG 21c, 28h/190 hp6400 rpm/Invoice $22,238-$24,858/IIHS.org G,M,A
2006 Dodge Charger 3.5L SE/103 cu ft interior/24 cu ft luggage/MPG 19c, 27h/250 hp6400 rpm/Invoice $20,983-$29,330/IIHS.org G,M,-
2007 Nissan Maxima 3.5L SE/104 cu ft interior/16 cu ft luggage/MPG 21c, 28h (premium gas)/255 hp6000 rpm/Invoice $25,648-$34,831/IIHS.org G,M,P
2006 Kia Amanti 3.8L base/105 cu ft interior/15 cu ft luggage/200 hp5500 rpm/Invoice $25,510-$27,505/IIHS.org G,-,A
2007 Chevy Impala 3.5L LS/105 cu ft interior/19 cu ft luggage/MPG 20c, 29h/211 hp5800 rpm/Invoice $19,618-$20,968/IIHS.org A,G,P
2006 Toyota Avalon 3.5L XL/107 cu ft interior/14 cu ft luggage/MPG 22c, 31h/268 hp6200 rpm/Invoice $$23,921-$27,880/IIHS.org G,G,P
2007 Hyundai Azera 3.8L SE/107 cu ft interior/17 cu ft luggage/MPG 19c, 28h/263 hp6000 rpm/Invoice $21,901-$24,424/IIHS.org G,A,A
2007 Buick Lucerne 3.8L CX/108 cu ft interior/17 cu ft luggage/MPG 19c, 28h/197 hp5200 rpm/Invoice $24,041-$28,512/IIHS.org G,A,P
2007 Ford Five Hundred 3.0L SEL/108 cu ft interior/21 cu ft luggage/MPG 21c, 29h/203 hp5750 rpm/Invoice $20,966-$26,340/IIHS.org G,G,G
Right now for 2006 Maxima has a rebate of $1,500, 2006 Amanti rebate $3,000, 2006 Impala rebate $2,000, 2006 Azera rebate $1,000, 2006 Lucerne rebate $1,500 and Incentive $1,000, 2006 Five Hundred REBATE $1,000.
Invoice prices listed above refers to the lowest trim only. Probably possible to get higher trims under $30,000 but not if it's fully loaded and how good of a negotiator you are.
Note that EPA city mileage isn't accurate but can be used as a guide.
Also The only large sedan listed with a fully loaded invoice above $30,000 is the Nissan Maxima SE.
All IIHS.org test scores are with side curtain airbags.
#14 of 6854 Re: Point taken.... [stevenw]
Jul 25, 2006 (9:47 am)
Sorry it was a typing error. I ment to print CHARGER!
#15 of 6854 Re: Large Sedans for Under $30,000 Comparision [buzz123]
Jul 25, 2006 (11:38 am)
I was pleased to see that CR rated the Hyundai Azera one slot below the Avalon, since it is a new model, it can't get the "recommended" designation. It's ranking was surprising, being higher than many of the cars listed here.
We purchased an Azera about 1.5 months ago and I am very pleased with the vehicle, performance, ride, handling etc. I think the Azera gives the Avalon a run for the money, and if Hyundai continues to maintain and improve quality (Bet large sedan by JD Power) just a month or so ago, it will give Hyundai a foothold in the large car market.
#16 of 6854 Re: Large Sedans for Under $30,000 Comparision [luvmbooty]
Jul 25, 2006 (3:48 pm)
Glad you like your RAV4! That is odd about the 4 cyls with the 3rd row. You're right, it makes sense that with the extra weight you would want more power. Glad you were able to find what you were looking for! Sounds like you got a great deal! I think you're right about the RAV4 being a better than the current Highlander. It'll be interesting to see what changes they make to the Highlander. That's great about the RAV4 being rated the top small SUV! Haven't decided yet if we want the 3rd row, but it's good to know the rear seat adjusts forward or back which helps 3rd row leg room. Thanks for the info! Enjoy your RAV4!
#17 of 6854 Re: Large Sedans for Under $30,000 Comparision [wamba2000]
Jul 25, 2006 (4:00 pm)
Glad you like your Azera! I purchased my Avalon before the Azera was released, so I wasn't able to consider it in my decision. However, from everything I've read, Hyundai really has done a great job turning things around with their new vehicles, including the Azera. You definitely get a lot more features for the price with the Azera over the Avalon. I think the biggest negative I can see about the Azera is mileage. The Azera is: City 19 MPG, Highway 28 MPG and the Avalon is: City 22 MPG, Highway 31 MPG. However, it's not a huge difference and if it was around when I was buying, I definitely would have given the Azera a test drive. I've got a bad back and if the Azera was more comfortable than the Avalon, then I'd be willing to sacrifice a couple of MPG and go with the Azera. Unfortunately, since I've had bad luck with American cars, I only considered something from Toyota or Honda but next time I'll probably add Hyundai to that list. If the American companies can turn things around like Hyundai, I may even add them back to my list. It'll be interesting to see if Hyundai can keep this up. I think you're right when you said "...if Hyundai continues to maintain and improve quality (Bet large sedan by JD Power) just a month or so ago, it will give Hyundai a foothold in the large car market." I look forward to testing driving an Azera when it comes time to trade in my Avalon. Of course, that won't be for another 10 years or so, but at least by then it should be clear how Hyundai is really doing. Enjoy your Azera!
#18 of 6854 Re: Check out these numbers... [luvmbooty]
Jul 25, 2006 (4:26 pm)
Now I see what you meant earlier when you said "...I would prefer the best protection for my family with a tested car like the Five Hundred..." Looks like the 500 has the best IIHS test score! That's definitely a big plus for the 500. At least my Avalon came in second. Are you thinking of getting a 500?
#19 of 6854 Re: Check out these numbers... [buzz123]
Jul 25, 2006 (10:27 pm)
You bet! I love the roomy interior and huge trunk. I also love styling. Many critics say the Five Hundred lacks styling but I love the VW Passat and Jetta's look but if I'm spending that kind of money I'd prefer size. I read somewhere that a VW designer helped with the Five Hundred's making.
Also the Five Hundred shares its platform with the Volvo S80, which is why I'd expect how it got those test scores. I think if Ford wants to stay in the business of selling cars, this strategy is the way to go. Down sizing and taking the best parts from each make and create one "super sedan". Say for instance, Mazda 6 sportiness, Five Hundred's interior, trunk and price, Volvo platform, comfort interior from Mercury, a refined engine and trany from Lincoln or Jaguar. I don't know. Just an idea.
For now I'm happy with the Five Hundred. What I like about it the most is its price. I think it's a lot of car for the money and so is the Hyundai Sonata, another sedan I've been considering.
Sonata's government test scores were all 5's. Like styling.
IIHS.org gave it G,A,G, which is better than most. Can't beat price especially with current rebate of $2,500 for the GLS V6 or LX trims. You could easily get a GLS V6 for under $18,000! All safety features are standard (6 airbags, traction, and stability). As they say, "Best Warranty in America." The Sonata offers 105 cu ft interior and 16 cu ft trunk. V6 engines put out 235 hp6000 rpms. Consumer Report's doesn't rate it since it's a new design but recent previous models have had good reliability records (2003-2005). CR did give the Five Hundred its highest recommendation, though.
#20 of 6854 Re: Large Sedans for Under $30,000 Comparision [buzz123]
Jul 26, 2006 (10:00 am)
you'll be pressed to find a reasonably well optioned Avalon for under $30k and they are still selling well enough that there has been no need for all the rebate/discounts available on the lesser cars. But, the base XL and perhaps even the sportier Touring can get to this kind of number - other than that (XLS/Ltd)you are looking at 33-40k, more competitive with things like TLs etc.
The Azera is interesting in that Hyundai has done a great job with its new V6s - but, it is certainly 'Buick' soft and needs to lose a little weight to improve FE. Resale value, of course, figures to be horrid. It surprises me that they are already starting 'Detroit style' discount programs on such a competent entry in this field.
The Maxima - wonderful powertrain, smaller than many here, certainly available in the higher 20s, and as is Nissan tradition a sportier, harder edged feel.
The 'American' entrants - hard to take seriously, they have yet to figure out how to build a competitive V6 engine. GM's 3.8 has been around for 50 years, and while it should durable, it is rough-as-cob and well behind in FE. The 3.6 in the Lacrosse/CTS (and Chrysler 3.5) better but still behind even what 'little ole' Hyundai has done - never mind the truly superior efforts from Toyota/Honda/Nissan. The Ford 3.0 DT a joke in what is otherwise a well designed (Swedish) car.
IMO, the best car in this range, the Avalon without a doubt - although you will pay a premium for it - the best value, probably the Azera. The 'Detroit' cars - better get them while they're hot (and cheap), some of them may not be available much longer!
#21 of 6854 Re: Large Sedans for Under $30,000 Comparision [captain2]
Jul 26, 2006 (10:30 am)
Not interested in the Upscale sedans priced over $30,000 like Acura, Lexus, or Audi. Too much money for a car just to get from point A to B.
I agree that the Avalon is the most refined sedan in this forum but like you said you'd pay a premium price for it. I also think that Toyota is being a little greedy not to give rebates or incentives for a soon to be one year old model. One reason why the Azera will give it a run for its money.
I don't believe that the 'Detroit' cars are on their way out though. There are many people who are fans of American cars. I think as long as the 'Detroit' cars will be competitive as long as they keep their prices down. The Five Hundred will be getting a better engine in 2008. I think it's the Duratech 3.5 with hp of 250.
#22 of 6854 Re: Check out these numbers... [luvmbooty]
Jul 26, 2006 (4:04 pm)
I know what you mean about styling. Critics say the same thing about the Avalon, but I like the styling of the Avalon and the Five Hundred much better than the Chrysler 300. It's pretty cool that a VW designer helped with the Five Hundred and that it shares its platform with the Volvo S80. I think your idea of Ford "Down sizing and taking the best parts from each make and create one super sedan..." is just what they need to turn things around. All the specs and everything about the Five Hundred look great. It's definitely a lot of car for the money. I can definitely see why you'd be considering it. If I hadn't had so many problems with American cars in the past, I probably would have given it a test drive and considered it myself. Hopefully, Ford and other American companies continue this trend so I can add them to my list again when it comes time to trade in my Avalon. That's interesting about the Sonata doing better than the Azera in the IIHS test scores. I can definitely see why you'd be considering the Sonata. Looks like it has a lot of pluses as well. Good time of year to be buying with all the rebates they have now.