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What to expect from the next model year Prius - READ ONLY

311 messages,  Last post on Apr 26, 2009 at 6:43 AM

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What is this discussion about? Toyota Prius, Hybrid Cars, Car Buying, Hatchback, Sedan

Messages Page 31 of 32

#299 of 311 Re: swap-out for Li-Ion batteries in the future [kdhspyder] by dodgeman07

Jan 18, 2009 (5:47 pm)

Replying to: kdhspyder (Jan 18, 2009 1:02 pm)
kdhspyder wrote: Others like me are not interested in a compact vehicle at any price or fuel saving.
 
I agree with this statement but many use Hybrids as their 2nd car. Myself? The Insight is too small for me being a single owner of one vehicle. I would consider a Prius but can't justify $26-28K for the gain over a non-hybrid at $20-$22K.
 
My brother-in-law however, planned to buy an '09 Prius and now is having second thoughts. The price advantage of the Insight is too great to ignore. With similar equipment levels we're talking about over $6K. That's a lot of money to all but the wealthiest people out there.
 
Time will tell but Toyota is not nearly as well positioned with their product mix as they were just one year ago. They will fill that gap by 2011 with an entry level hydrid and a much improved Yaris. They are too good a company not to give the market what it wants.
 
P.S. I believe we'll see a lot of HS250h's on the road by 2011 if they can keep under $35K loaded.

#300 of 311 Re: swap-out for Li-Ion batteries in the future [backy] by kdhspyder

Jan 18, 2009 (8:29 pm)

Replying to: backy (Jan 18, 2009 1:53 pm)
Here is a pretty fair write up by two Canadian writers when they were invited by Honda to test out the new Insight in Arizona.
 
Canadian view of the Insight II
 
Apparently from background ingo provided by Honda the Insight II is specifically targetting the younger demographic which might otherwise buy a conventional vehicle in the $15000 - $20000 range.

#301 of 311 Re: swap-out for Li-Ion batteries in the future [kdhspyder] by backy

Jan 18, 2009 (9:32 pm)

Replying to: kdhspyder (Jan 18, 2009 8:29 pm)
And I'm sure many in that target demographic will take a look at it. Just as many outside the target demographic will buy one. Ever sell a Corolla to someone over 50 years old, even though they are not in the target demographic for the Corolla?
 
Maybe what is needed is a Prius vs. Insight discussion.

#302 of 311 Which will be cheaper built, Insight or Prius? [kdhspyder] by gagrice

Jan 19, 2009 (6:35 am)

Replying to: kdhspyder (Jan 18, 2009 8:29 pm)
Do hybrid buyers even care about quality parts?
 
Indeed, Honda has radically reduced the quality of materials in the new Insight. The interior cloth trim - seats, doors, etc. - is incredibly thin, the flimsiest such cloth seen in a Honda since an early '90s Civic.
 
Ditto the roof liner, which gives new meaning to the term "rat's fur." The interior's plastics are not much better. Though the dashboard is reminiscent of the Civic's futuristic gauge display, its plastic surround is not nearly of such high quality.

#303 of 311 Re: Which will be cheaper built, Insight or Prius? [gagrice] by kdhspyder

Jan 19, 2009 (8:12 am)

Replying to: gagrice (Jan 19, 2009 6:35 am)
This has been my contention all along. The price of the Insight II controls what the content will be. In order to appeal to the pricing demographic at which it's targetted, the content has to be modified downward. No manufacturer can put a $25000 vehicle into an $18500 MSRP and expect to remain in business. To sell a vehicle with an MSRP of $18500 including a $1500 hybrid option the vehicle has to be a non-hybrid with a $17000 MSRP.
 
Think of which vehicles today have a $17000 MSRP, the Aveo, the Yaris, the Fit and the Versa. These are all a class below the Cobalt, Focus, Corolla, Civic and Sentra in content, materials, performance, smoothness and quietness.

#304 of 311 Re: Which will be cheaper built, Insight or Prius? [kdhspyder] by gagrice

Jan 19, 2009 (8:37 am)

Replying to: kdhspyder (Jan 19, 2009 8:12 am)
The misconception is that a little car costs less to build than a big car. The difference in the cost of a fender for a big PU truck and a Corolla is probably just in the cost of the metal. Same labor and tooling cost. So to sell a Yaris for $12k as my son in law bought, something has to be eliminated. For those that have to have a hybrid and cannot afford more than $20k the Insight will probably be the ticket. I think I would rather have more plush and forgo the economy if I were to buy a sub $20k car. Of course that is unlikely.

#305 of 311 Re: Which will be cheaper built, Insight or Prius? [kdhspyder] by dodgeman07

Jan 19, 2009 (4:01 pm)

Replying to: kdhspyder (Jan 19, 2009 8:12 am)
...smoothness and quietness.
 
That is where Toyota will be 2 notches above the Insight. The Insight EX w/navi for $23K could hardly be considered "de-contented" as far as options go and the performance will be similar also.
 
NVH and interior materials are a different story. Honda smells a victory here and will get with many buyers who aren't that picky (read under 30). Those willing to pay for refinement will stick with the Prius because it's clearly a lot more car - you just have to be willing to pay for it.

#306 of 311 Interesting new report out of Japan by kdhspyder

Jan 19, 2009 (4:48 pm)

Nikkei today reporting that Toyota is going to keep the Gen 2 ( for how long ) and decontent it in order to lower the price to compete with the Insight.
 
The new Gen 3 then will launch as planned with prices in the $25000 - $35000 range. Interesting but it makes sense in Toyota's marketing scheme. Today the Corolla covers the backside of the Camry and the Yaris covers the backside of the Corolla. Thus the Camry doesn't have to be discounted to fight every new player trying to buy into the market.
 
The Gen 2 Prius if it kept in production for this weirdo year of 2009 would protect the backside of the Gen 3 being priced from $20000 - $25000.
 
The gentlemanliness of the hybrid market is breaking down with the vehicle makers going after one another now... Insight vs Prius vs HCH...FFH vs TCH... Vue 2-Mode vs HH and FEH.

#307 of 311 Re: Interesting new report out of Japan [kdhspyder] by gagrice

Jan 19, 2009 (9:16 pm)

Replying to: kdhspyder (Jan 19, 2009 4:48 pm)
The Gen 2 Prius if it kept in production for this weirdo year of 2009 would protect the backside of the Gen 3 being priced from $20000 - $25000.
 
Using the Edmund's View Inventory feature, Noticed one dealer here has a 2009 Prius with MSRP of $19,314. I did not think they sold any under $20k.

#308 of 311 Re: Interesting new report out of Japan [gagrice] by dodgeman07

Jan 22, 2009 (8:03 pm)

Replying to: gagrice (Jan 19, 2009 9:16 pm)
Using the Edmund's View Inventory feature, Noticed one dealer here has a 2009 Prius with MSRP of $19,314. I did not think they sold any under $20k.
 
By spring we should low-optioned '09 Prius' at $20K regularly. Toyota going the route kdhspyder suggested above makes this all but certain.
 
If I can find a nicely equipped '09 Prius for $22K this summer - it's sold!

Messages Page 31 of 32

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