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Hybrid Vehicles Toyota Prius What to expect from the next model year Prius
311 messages, Last post on Apr 26, 2009 at 5:43 AM
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Replying to: larsb (Jan 13, 2009 7:17 am) It is clear that Toyota ( and Honda and Ford ) have decided to stick to a strategy of selling high volume affordable hybrids to a wide range of clients. These 3 were the first to market and they've staked out their claims to the center where the largest volumes are. This is the place where the most potential profits are located and where they have the best opportunity to maintain a significant presence. The other makers now have to maneuver around these first three somehow. GM is trying to outflank them with it's E-Flex and the Volt but IMO it's longshot and very risky. While GM can end up making a spectacular vehicle how many can actually step up and buy one. In the meanwhile Toyota/Honda/Ford will be selling much much greater volumes of hybrids and actually generating cash rewards.
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Replying to: kdhspyder (Jan 13, 2009 8:29 am) I don't think you will get any new converts to the 2010 Prius. It looks essentially the same and will appeal to the same crowd. It is hard to argue with the fact that people that have them love them. I'm still waiting for the plug-in Sequoia Hybrid that gets 42 MPG combined. California will get their way with the new EPA and that is the mandate for fleet mileage. I need to get my last final diesel SUV before the curtain falls.
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Replying to: gagrice (Jan 17, 2009 6:57 am)  My buddy who also posts here just hit 226,000 miles on it's 5th anniversay...when he gave me his order for Prius No 3. He wants the first one we get as long as it's black and doesn't have leather. It appears that the frame is underpinned by a tubular stabilzer and it runs on wider tires. There is also an option for even wider lower-profile 17" tires. The peak of the roof is moved back over the back seat. The vehicle is about 100# heavier with a larger engine and a few additional amenitites on the standard versions. The big difference is that is will be somewhat quicker and go from 46 mpg EPA combined to about 50 mpg EPA comined. They went with the larger engine to make it more capable in fuel efficiency at the highway at higher US-Interstate-type speeds. The 1.8L is better mated to the size and weight of the vehicle than the 1.5L was. The additional drivetrain features ( EV, ECON, PWR ) will only improve the power or the fuel economy. |
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Replying to: gagrice (Jan 17, 2009 6:57 am)  . Actually we had about 30 a month ago but that's down to about 8 now. But like every other survivor we're just looking to cut inventory as well as fixed costs. I'm guessing that this will be the strategy throughout all of 2009. If GM's recent estimate is accurate then instead of 16 MM units we may be approaching 10 MM units.....with a 3 MM unit inventory carryover... bad juju there. That means that production may only reach 7-8 MM units in 2009. 2009 is going to be a downer for everyone in every product line.
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Replying to: kdhspyder (Jan 17, 2009 1:21 pm) http://www.edmunds.com/inventory/vin.html?year=&make=Toyota&model=Prius
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Replying to: gagrice (Jan 17, 2009 3:31 pm) But...it should be a huge hit because it will fall right in the sweetest part of the buying public's vision. At $18500 to $20500 it will appeal to a lot of buyers who have passed on the hybrids up until now. I think that it will do more damage to vehicles like the Corolla, Mazda3, Focus, Cobalt and non-hybrid Civic in this price range because it will get a real world 42-43 mpg day-in and day-out. That's well above the 33-ish mpg that those other non-hybrids get. The vehicle is very very tight in back. But I haven't driven one yet and nobody except the reviewers has even seen one.
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Replying to: kdhspyder (Jan 18, 2009 10:41 am) I do think some people will cross-shop both the Insight and Prius, just because they are looking for a hybrid hatchback that can seat at least 2 kids in back. I will probably shop both when I get our next long term car in 3-4 years. It remains to be seen whether that cross-shopping will happen in any numbers and if there will be any price pressure on the base price of the Prius because of it. |
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Replying to: kdhspyder (Jan 18, 2009 10:41 am) This is not quite true. The Insight II is larger than the Fit by 11" in overall length and 2" in wheelbase. It has a completely different body also. The rear seat is where the Prius vs. Insight show the greatest difference in size with the Prius offering mid-size rear seat room and the Insight is clearly compact. I believe the Insight will bleed off significant Prius sales with it's $6K price advantage. Overall performance is similar and real world MPG will likely be very close. The areas the Prius beats the Insight is one level in size (only an issue if you regularly carry 3 people or more) and amenities (which for $6K in the 2009 economy is hard to justify). Honda has beaten Toyota in this new game. While Toyota's refinement will pay off with some buyers, I bet most will opt for the true value that this Honda offers.
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Replying to: dodgeman07 (Jan 18, 2009 11:43 am)  $24000 - $26000 and certainly not at $29000. The very-frugal or just-starting-out buyers don't want to or can't spend $25K for any vehicle. So til now they've opted NOT to buy the Prius at all. This is the group that will embrace the Insight II. The current buyers of the Prius are an entirely different demographic with entirely different expectations. They expect to pay $25000 - $35000 or more for their vehicles and they are capable of doing that. Others like me are not interested in a compact vehicle at any price or fuel saving. The two will be cross-shopped but the differences will be clear shortly. Those who will naturally gravitate toward the Insigt II will do so and those want something more will gravitate toward the Prius. The Insight II is somewhat under the current Gen Prius but significantly behind the Gen 3 Prius. But since this is such a huge market there is room for both easily. As you note though the pricing differences in this current economy are significantly in Honda's favor. If everybody gets religion and damn the amenities then the Insight will shine even brighter. But then there's 2,3 and 5 yrs from now. Honda is limited by its technology ( for now ) to smaller more basic vehicles. It can't really scale it's IMA up to midsized vehicles very well. At some point in the near future the market will stabilize and return to a form of normalcy.
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