Article Comments: The World's Quickest Hatchback

48 messages, Last post on Dec 08, 2006 at 1:53 PM

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What is this discussion about? Mazda MAZDASPEED MAZDA3, Hatchback

Article comments for Japanese First Drive: Mazdaspeed 3/Axela MPS - If Mazda ever needed a successful volume-selling car to ensure its survival, then the Mazda 3 is it. In just under three years, the popular hatch has sold more than 920,000 units worldwide and rates as one of the most competitive and best-handling hatches on the market. (more)

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#1 of 48 Article Comments: The World's Quickest Hatchback by KarenS HOST Jul 17, 2006 (8:21 am)
It will be here soon! Do you want it? Japanese First Drive: Mazdaspeed 3/Axela MPS
#2 of 48 Final Price in U.S. by hal9000 Jul 17, 2006 (6:34 pm)
Price will be key for me purchasing this vehicle. While the review states a 21,000 U.S. price...you'd be lucky to get a 3 Grand Touring w/roof for that price..if this could be had with roof and navi for under 25,000 I'd buy. Replies to this message: aviboy97 (Jul 18, 2006 8:52 am)
#3 of 48 I don't understand the hoopla. by ciaoman Jul 17, 2006 (6:42 pm)
A light Hatch with 268 hp and even more torque, with a 6 speed, and all it does is 6.1 secs 0-60? Front wheel drive instead of all-wheel to save weight and this is the result? While it may be the hottest in its segment, I'll stick with my Legacy GT with a 5 speed, less hp and torgue and "heavy" all-wheel drive--a reputable car mag recently tested it and found that it does 0-60 in 5.1 secs. What gives? Perhaps the Mazda's biggest advantage is price. The subie is considerably more $$. Replies to this message: chacobleu (Jul 18, 2006 7:09 am) aviboy97 (Jul 18, 2006 8:06 am) tsy (Jul 18, 2006 1:59 pm) d_hyper (Jul 18, 2006 8:46 am) roadwarriors (Jul 18, 2006 10:53 am)
#4 of 48 0-60 in 6.1 sec? by prosource1 Jul 18, 2006 (3:36 am)
My Dad's new Hyundai Azera is a 263 hp and is a large, heavy sedan. It has been clocked at 0-60 in 6.1 secs. It's quick, but I cannot understand why this 3 with about the same horsepower, is much lighter and has a 6-speed tranny, isn't getting better numbers than the heavier Azera.
#5 of 48 Re: I don't understand the hoopla. [ciaoman] by chacobleu Jul 18, 2006 (7:09 am)
Replying to: ciaoman (Jul 17, 2006 6:42 pm) its a trade-off, kind of... torque steer is an issue and gears 1-3 have been tuned for limited torque/hp in those gears. since those are the same gears (at least 1 & 2) used to produce 0-60 spirnts, it is by no coincidence that sprint times would be held in check, as well. with awd and tweaking as such, torque would not be such an issue in gears 1-3, thus limiting those gears would not be necessary. At the same time, the weight gain from awd would scrub any torque/hp differences between limiting and not limiting gears 1-3. In essence, 0-60 sprints would have very similar results with or without awd. so, it came to added weight and costs without any speed benefits. so the story goes, until winter rears its head (that is where the trade-off ends) - no awd, gobs of torque in gears 1-3 (regardless of its limits), and summer only tires. Maybe Mazda thought about another warning sticker regarding the speedster and driving in the snow (it should go next to the warning about sitting children in the front seats)
#6 of 48 Re: I don't understand the hoopla. [ciaoman] by aviboy97 Jul 18, 2006 (8:06 am)
Replying to: ciaoman (Jul 17, 2006 6:42 pm) The Legacy GT does not do 0-60 in 5.1 seconds. It is closer to 6 seconds. 5.7 or 5.8 I think? However, I think Mazda under estimated what the 0-60 time is. I guess we will have to wait and see. p.s. The 600 lb heavier big brother to the Mazdaspeed3, Mazdaspeed6, does 0-60 in 6.0 seconds with only 6 more hp. I must say, I am as confused as all of you are. Replies to this message: tsy (Jul 18, 2006 1:59 pm)
#7 of 48 Re: I don't understand the hoopla. [ciaoman] by d_hyper Jul 18, 2006 (8:46 am)
Replying to: ciaoman (Jul 17, 2006 6:42 pm) These are mfg'r numbers. I guess they didn't want to "offend" the big and more expensive brother - MZ6, which will still be in showrooms.
#8 of 48 Re: Final Price in U.S. [hal9000] by aviboy97 Jul 18, 2006 (8:52 am)
Replying to: hal9000 (Jul 17, 2006 6:34 pm) There won't be a roof for the MS3.
#9 of 48 Re: I don't understand the hoopla. [ciaoman] by roadwarriors Jul 18, 2006 (10:53 am)
Replying to: ciaoman (Jul 17, 2006 6:42 pm) I don't think you understand that the numbers mentioned are Mazda's numbers. They are not road test numbers. It hasn't even been tested yet. When a manufacturer comes out with a new car they give a rough estimate of what the car can do. They usually understate that number (for many reasons). Especially since this is a brand new car. They don't want a bunch of problems on their hands if the car doesn't run exactly what they say it will do. When the SRT-4 came out I think it was rated at 215hp, 6.1 0-60 and 14.4 in the 1/4 mi. After a year, and some real world tests, which showed it could hit high 13's in the 1/4 and had more like 230hp, Dodge adjusted their numbers accordingly. No AWD to save weight? Um, not really. It was done to save money. AWD in this car might be nice but it would also run close to $30K and be competing with the Evo/STi. Not the market they were going for. Also, while there is the obvious advantage of AWD, there are also performance related drawbacks. AWD has more drive train loss. Which means that if it did have AWD in this same package it would be putting less actual HP to the ground. When an SRT-4 lines up against a WRX, both having about the same HP at the crank, the WRX if launched properly will take the early lead but eventally it WILL get walked by the SRT-4 the faster they go. That's mostly why AWD cars don't have that great of a top end. This car will be good for 5.5 0-60 times (which mean nothing by the way) and a sub 14 sec 1/4mi. Just wait until the real testing begins. By they way, a Legacy GT will not cut a 5.1 0-60, it's closer to about 6 seconds...
#10 of 48 Re: I don't understand the hoopla. [aviboy97] by tsy Jul 18, 2006 (1:59 pm)
Replying to: aviboy97 (Jul 18, 2006 8:06 am) The 6.1 sec 0-60 time may be correct. The article talks about the ECU limiting the torque in first through third gears. Also, if the tranny's geared so you have to hit 3rd, that will slow down the 0-60 time. (does it really matter except for bragging rights?) I seems Mazda has done a nice job in making an affordable sporty hatchback. I think it will do well. BTW, (for what it's worth) a Legacy GT with summer tires will do a 5.4-5.5 0-60 (it hits 60 in 2nd gear so there's only one shift). With some mild mods that time will drop closer to 5.1 sec. But it's not in the same class as the MS3. tom