Last post on Nov 28, 2013 at 9:19 AM
You are in the Honda Fit
What is this discussion about?
Honda Fit, Tires, Wheels
#187 of 212 Re: Winter Tire Purchase for my 2010 Fit Sport? [fit_owner_2010]
Jan 28, 2012 (10:14 pm)
I have a 2009 FIT basic model with oem tire size 175/65/15. I thought about changing the wheel to 16" for better handling in snow, but Discount Tire recommend that I keep the same 15" wheel and just get a larger tire size.
So I replaced it with 195/60/15 today. The ride is just as stiff as before, not sure about noise yet. But definitely no more sliding in snow/ice after the replacement (actually had 2 inches last night here).
I should know more during normal commuting..
#188 of 212 cupping/scalloping rear tires
Mar 01, 2012 (6:28 am)
My '08 Fit Sport has had a problem from day one. It developed a vibration in the rear tires very soon. I'm an old guy, so my experience tells me to look for wear in the fronts to tell me to rotate. After all, the front tires have most of the weight, do the powering and turning. I really didn't expect the rears to need to have their wear equalized by shifting them to the front before the fronts needed it. My mistake. At 30,000 miles my Dunlop tires were so scalloped in the rear (both sides) I decided to get an alignment and new tires. I chose the Kumho Ecsta Platinum LX from Tire Rack because they had a treadwear of 600. My mechanic told me my rear alignment was out of the specified range but there was no provision for adjustment, so I needed a shim kit. Fine, fix it.
I considered the matter fixed until I noticed the vibration return, again in the rear. This time, at 60,000+ (30,000+ on the Kumhos). I returned to my mechanic and told him when I rotated my tires to the front the vibration was unbearable. I asked him why his solution didn't work. He ranted at me about not rotating often enough. I responded by asking why the cupping occurred in the first place. He accused me of driving underinflated, through potholes, etc. Blame the victim. I read about the problems with the Toyota Matrix, which had a similar problem.
I developed a theory:
1) The Honda Fit camber specs are excessively negative (tipped inward at the top) to allow better handling and wider stance for increased rollover resistance.
2) This negative camber, along with the very light rear axle weight causes the tires to "scuff" at certain frequencies resulting in scalloping.
3) The official response to this situation by Honda and supported by unimaginative mechanics is to encourage excessive rotation to mask the uneven tire wear.
4) People have become desensitized to unusually poor tire life because they are participating in the ruse, if they rotate every 3,000 miles or so the treads get erased evenly.
Sorry this is so long! My solution was to find another mechanic with an alignment machine and tell him to get yet another shim kit and bring the camber to vertical. After telling him three times, the British mechanic finally "got it" and my rear wheels are now straight up and down, actually -.25 degree, just slightly out of spec. BTW, don't expect every spec to be the same on every machine. The recent alignment from my old mechanic came out out of specs on the second machine. My new tires are General General G-MAX AS-03. I have no idea if this will work but I really want to make the Fit a car that stops eating tires!
#189 of 212 Re: cupping/scalloping rear tires [coastofmaine]
Mar 01, 2012 (6:53 am)
tks for this message...i am about to have my tires rotated...for the 1st time after having the same cupping/scalloping problems with Dunlops that came with my 07 Sport model when i first bought it...thumping etc...
i hope and pray i dont have a problem after rotating these Michelin tires that i love...but the above info is very intesting and i will save it for the future...i too believe that what you are reporting is totally accurate and Honda has messed up with this Fit...
p.s. i also got did not rotate enough; drove with underinflated tires etc..
perhaps the Fit people should start making sure they send in complaints to Honda and safety people...it worked for the light problem. honda did a recall
#190 of 212 Re: cupping/scalloping rear tires [eli8]
Mar 01, 2012 (9:40 am)
It's good to hear that maybe I'm not crazy. I have a long drive coming up and I may be able to get enough miles on to test my remedy. You're right about reporting to Honda, I'm sure it's a matter of complaint volume. After spending over a thousand dollars on this problem I should let Honda know. Hey, maybe they read these forums! Please let us know if your Michelins are cupped.
#191 of 212 Re: cupping/scalloping rear tires [eli8]
Mar 01, 2012 (11:39 am)
What worries me the most is that it will take a major "disaster" before
Honda steps up to plate on this. Should send out letters to everyone that
has purchased Honda Fit..from earliest one to current one and have them
take the Honda Fit in for a FREE inspection and having the tire/the balance/and all related issues fixed. My 2009 Honda Fit will be paid for next Feb 2013 and I will be looking for another car. There are others with better gas milage (and that also had not proved to be very good for many on this post) and comfort than the "Hondas" that we were used to being so reliable. I will never feel safe driving a long distance with my grandkids and I also will never buy another car that only has a 10 gallon gas tank.
I get nervous when there is long distance between gas stations when I am on interstate...plus always worrying when one of the wheels will go bad. I try and avoid every little crack in road, the curbs, and anything that might jolt too hard against the wheels. Never dreamed I would have all this to think abt when I should be out driving for pleasure.
#192 of 212 Re: cupping/scalloping rear tires [coastofmaine]
Mar 02, 2012 (10:56 am)
A couple of thoughts:
First, unless the alignment is absolutely perfect, tires are going to wear unevenly. The further away from perfect the alignment is, the faster that occurs. There real problem here is that once a tire starts an uneven wear pattern, it is difficult to wear a different pattern into the tire. That's why the generalized 5K to 8K rotation.
Second, because most tire wear occurs in the cornering mode, even vehicles with perfect alignment COULD get uneven wear patterns. Again, the 5K to 8K rotation schedule prevents this.
#193 of 212 Re: cupping/scalloping rear tires [capriracer]
Mar 02, 2012 (1:32 pm)
I do keep my tires rotated and all, but if you look back on this forum, you will see that many of us had new tires and the problems started anyway. To have a new tire or tires and then the tire goes bad--that is our big issue and many of us have spent much money we never thought we would have to spend getting new tires.
#194 of 212 Re: cupping/scalloping rear tires [capriracer]
Mar 02, 2012 (6:22 pm)
If Honda makes the Fit without the provision for alignment (rear) than having the perfect alignment is "but a fleeting illusion". My beef is not only uneven wear, which may be masked by frequent rotations, but rapid wear, its evil twin. Uneven wear in the rear has a discrete cause, it is not caused by not rotating. Also, I do not accept your premise that uneven wear is practically unavoidable, especially on the rears. There are MANY cars on the road now which experience no uneven wear on the rears. Why do Fit owners have to put up with this? I just talked with a Ford engineer today who never rotates his Focus tires. He just replaces his fronts with his rears and buys 2 new ones for the rears. This is what I did for 40 years before I bought a Fit.
#195 of 212 Re: cupping/scalloping rear tires [judymalone]
Apr 09, 2012 (2:02 pm)
Well, it's been over 3000 miles since I've had my rears aligned to -1/4 degree of camber (essentially vertical) and I can report that there is no cupping/scalloping whatsoever. I am becoming more convinced that this problem (excessive negative camber), seen with many light hatchbacks or SUVs is just a titanic mistake by engineers from many manufacturers. Amazingly, their first remedy is to blame the owners for not rotating. When that fails, they blame the tires. In some cases they have found tires which seem to resist the wear--this would work best if the tires were actually made with the inner diameter smaller than the outer, but fine, whatever works. The easiest remedy however, is to buck up and find a mechanic who is willing to do away with the negative camber by inserting shims in the case of the Fit (from Napa). Good luck to all, if I end up with the problem down the road I will post it here. As for rotating, I am trying to be scientific, which means I have to change only one variable at a time. That means no rotating for me until I get to at least 20,000 on these tires. By then I will know for sure if the cupping problem is solved.
#196 of 212 Re: cupping/scalloping rear tires [judymalone]
Sep 22, 2012 (6:49 am)
That don't sound very intelligent. All cars come with cheap tires and only good for about 25k when they are 36k warranty, only a moron would use that warranty to get the same cheap tires. Go spend $800 on a great set of all season all surface tires for the smoothest ride 80k warranty and the best traction even on icy snow covered roads. Done this with a 2003 eclipse, drove thru blizzards and snow storms for 4 consecutive days, rescued several people stranded in the ditch and lead many others to nearest town driving thru the night.
Distance between gas stations on the interstate, must be joking. I have never driven anywhere in this country I didn't see a gas stop along a interstate for more than 40 miles. That would be less than 1.5 gallons why worry. Have you ever driven thru Wyoming? that is probably the worst place for gas stops and still I seen one every 40 miles or less on their highways.