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Toyota Avalon Limited vs. Lexus ES 350 Comparison

194 messages,  Last post on Apr 24, 2009 at 3:24 AM

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What is this discussion about? Toyota Avalon, Lexus ES 350

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#188 of 194 Emotional factors: ES 350 vs. Avalon by marylandgal Mar 29, 2009 (6:25 pm)
I bought my first new car when the ES 350 first came out and I was down to the wire between it and the Avalon. While I was mulling this over and test driving everything again and again while sitting at stop lights I started noticing that those who drove the Avalon were, uh, a bit older than I (I am 50). In my area of Maryland it seems that many of the Avalon drivers fit the over 60 crowd. The nail in the coffin for Avalon occurred when I told my 21 year old car buff son what I was considering and he was adamant that his mom was not ready to join the blue hair set! It made me howl with laughter but more importantly brought to the surface what a tough job these car designers have with the myriad of factors that come into play when one buys a car. BTW, I love my ES 350, especially the heated and ventilated seats, but will probably turn it in when the lease is up and buy a hybrid of some kind.
#189 of 194 Re: Preaching to the converted [55396] by a1s1a1 Apr 15, 2009 (8:29 pm)
Replying to: 55396 (Mar 20, 2009 2:16 pm) "Perception" is the most important thing which makes a commodoity (Lexus ES in this case) more desirable and hence worthy to own by the ones who can afford it. What makes us percieve things in a particular way is a complex interaction of prestige/styling/worthiness/reliability/fit/finish/after sales service etc.   Whether the ES shares 20% or 100% parts with avalon really doesn't matter as their personalities and the statement they made are completely different.   Trying to debate and rationalize why you didn't get the ES but instead got the avalon or camry is like saying that the 30 dollar shoe that you got from K Mart last weekend is almost as good as the expensive Allen Ed. or johnston murphy. Heck! both are made in China too   Obviously, each of us have a very different perception of cars which keeps the forums like this alive but in general and for the most part a Lexus is a Lexus, whereas a toyota is a toyota nationally and globally! Which concludes my point that an average car buyer doesn't really care how many parts or attributes these cars share but more importantly how each of this car is percieved by them and others who see them in their rides.   Sounds very superficial! Well unfortunately that is how it is. Enjoy your ride whatever you drive or whatever you can afford to drive. Replies to this message: 55396 (Apr 15, 2009 9:14 pm) lexpaul (Apr 16, 2009 9:42 pm)
#190 of 194 Re: Preaching to the converted [a1s1a1] by 55396 Apr 15, 2009 (9:14 pm)
Replying to: a1s1a1 (Apr 15, 2009 8:29 pm) Yes, to each his own. I can afford to buy about any car I want, but I bought my Avalon strictly on price and the fact that it was a good car and a Toyota. Then proceeded to make it what I wanted. Drives and looks much better now. We prefer sporty. Loved the new/old VW CC, but the ES350 should be coming off lease soon and I will be in line. The CC may be next, but don't trust European reliability.   I passed on an 07 ES350 with low miles and loaded. Asking price was $24k with a list in the mid 40's. I'm thinkin I screwed up. No sales tax either. A Boxster is still in my heart though. I have a 90 Lexus LS400 with under 60k that drives like new, but rarely gets driven. I keep thinking I should sell it and get my Boxster, but then again, I think "Where could I ever get this much car again for that price?" Can't keep em both as both garages are full now. Decisions, decisions. I usually let the $$ decide. A big new fancy piece of depreciation just isn't worth it to me. Personal choice. Rather see an investment grow, but then, that ain't happenin either.
#191 of 194 Re: Preaching to the converted [a1s1a1] by lexpaul Apr 16, 2009 (9:42 pm)
Replying to: a1s1a1 (Apr 15, 2009 8:29 pm) I guess I couldn't have expressed my feeling any better than you. You summed it up for me really well. Perception is indeed the key issue here, but IMO and I drove the Avalon Limited before deciding on the ES 350 Level III, is that Lexus is a better built car and it does come with a more should I say prestigious, luxurious and upscale demeanor. Lexus carries a well earned badge of a high value car.   The overall experience of owning a Lexus from dealership pampering and high grade/quality fit and finish places the car in a different class than the Avalon. I know I'm saying the same things you are but maybe in a different 'way'. I do believe you get what you pay for most of the time.   However, the Avalon was rated the best large size car in its class by US News Car Rankings and I believe its a great car but just not in the same class as a Lexus and I have never seen it rated in the same category/class as a Lexus. And that's my 'perception'....
#192 of 194 Cross shopped all 3 by 1lotlizard Apr 23, 2009 (10:39 am)
I recently cross shopped Avalon, ES350, Camry, and several other competitors and settled on Avalon Limited. All are very nice but, compared to ES350, Avalon is a true 5 passenger car with a flat floor in the back seat. It also has way more head room in back. I am 6'2'' and was unable sit in any of the back seat positions in the ES350. The rear center position in the ES350 is of little value for most situations. For the cars I tested, the Avalon had considerably less vibration, too. I also like that Avalon's manual calls for 87 octane. I ruled out Camry because even the top line leather interior had a short driver's seat that lacked thigh support for me. Replies to this message: 55396 (Apr 23, 2009 11:35 am)
#193 of 194 Re: Cross shopped all 3 [1lotlizard] by 55396 Apr 23, 2009 (11:35 am)
Replying to: 1lotlizard (Apr 23, 2009 10:39 am) No regular for the ES350? Or is it that they don't state it? I thought that they used the same engine. At any rate, the computer should adjust to the lower octane. I burn regular in our 03 AV when out of the ethanol states. No problem, and get up to 31 MPG running 80. I just saw a Kia ad crowing about 32 MPG for a cracker box. Big deal. Unless that was a combined number.
#194 of 194 Perception vs. Reality by mano3 Apr 24, 2009 (3:24 am)
The issue of perception is both on the money and off target as it specifically relates to the Avalon Lexus 350 issue.   Perception may or may not have a basis in reality. In this matter, the reality is that the Avalon and the 350 have a lot in common, starting with the engine. My next door neighbor has a 2008 350 and I'm surprised at the similarities between it and my 2007 Avalon Ltd. Surprisingly, my car has perforated/heated/cooled front seats and hers doesn't, but that's because she didn't order that with hers.   Nevertheless, my perception is that her Lexus is a luxury car and my Toyota is not. To me, Toyota is not a luxury car maker, but Lexus is, even though the Avalon Ltd. has some luxury engineering and details. My perception is that her car is more quiet and has a more luxury feel. The reality that the Avalon has so much in common with the Lexus gives me a greater sense of perceived value. Yet, I can see why Lexus charges and gets a premium for their cars.   a1s1a1, I'm a shoe guy. Allen Edmonds is made in the USA and is a very well crafted shoe. Johnston Murphy is made in various places overseas, but is also well made, albeit not up the the AE standards. There's no comparison between either and a KMart shoe, which is poorly made, regardless of where it's made.

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