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163 messages, Last post on Dec 04, 2008 at 4:53 AM
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Replying to: fshi (Jan 24, 2008 6:44 am) GM does not have a working hybrid that helps with fuel savings, period. They CLAIM 2 MPG more but in reality, it's no better than changing your driving habits and buying better fuel. Having more numbers does not mean leading. You need to look up what Toyota offers since you don't seem to know what they do offer. Either way, that's not the point. The point is GM's version of the hybrid is a hack job that's been cobbled together that's nothing but a scam to try and make people think they are green.
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Replying to: scortch (Jan 24, 2008 7:52 am) "GM does not have a working hybrid that helps with fuel savings, period. They CLAIM 2 MPG more but in reality, it's no better than changing your driving habits and buying better fuel." How about the buses? the coming full size suv and pickup truck will have a larger impact than the tiny prius. sure you can get 2mpg gain by changing driving habit, better fuel etc, but that is not a scientific way of measuring. everything being equal, that is the rule, and you can get 10% saving with this bas hybrid on top of what you just mentioned. As your comments that I do not know lot about toyota's hybrid offerings, where do you get that? people think toyota is greener, it is true, but not a whole lot, as it is expanding its product line to bigger vehicles. it truck is actually less efficient than gm's. their average fleet MPG is very similar to GM's. surprise?
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Replying to: fshi (Jan 24, 2008 8:07 am) Overall, GM's green advertising is a scam along with their hybrid offerings. One day, in the future, when every one else is using hydrogen, GM will come out with these fuel efficient suvs and trucks. The future is not now. Look how many years the Prius has been out and now the Camry and Highlander and Ford's hybrid offerings. GM is YEARS behind and then tries to make the people believe it's green. Yes, I am a GM owner too. I just think the Malibu hybrid is a scam. It's definitely not a TRUE hybrid in the way that Toyota has defined it and built it for the last 10+ years (7 years in the U.S.). The Prius and Camry compared to the Malibu, are more than capable of being compared to each other.
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Replying to: fshi (Jan 24, 2008 8:07 am) I think the word "coming" should say it all when the Prius is not just here and now, but has been here and proved itself for several years with excellent ownership ratings. Toyota made a powerfull big gas guzzling truck because the market demanded it. They also made the Prius and created the market for the hybrid. The Volt looks cool, but it's just hype at this point. Being 5 years ahead in the hybrid market is a huge lead. I really don't see anything like the Prius coming from GM on the horizon.  If reducing the use of oil and mpg is the ultimate goal, the Tahoe hybrid isn't going to buy much.
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Replying to: scortch (Jan 24, 2008 8:20 am) I think the Saturn VUE is doing ok for itself. It is bigger than the Escape Hybrid and gets better mileage on the highway. The Malibu is bigger than the Camry and has 50% more trunk space. That tiny trunk in the Camry would be a deal killer for me, if I was interested in a small sedan.
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Replying to: gagrice (Jan 24, 2008 9:49 pm) Go read a few issues to see what I mean. The database at gh.com shows the Vue Hybrid at 26 MPG and the Escape hybrid averaging in at 30.5 (2wd and 4wd included.) So it's last in it's class, and the most problematic for the owners. If being the worst and more troublesome in the category is "doing OK for itself" then I guess losers rule.......LOL...........
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Replying to: aspesisteve (Jan 24, 2008 8:44 pm) "If reducing the use of oil and mpg is the ultimate goal, the Tahoe hybrid isn't going to buy much." A double standard is clearly shown here. Toyota doing a big gas guzzler is ok because market demanded it. GM doing a big improvement (hybrid) on the tahoe isn't going to buy much.
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Replying to: fshi (Jan 25, 2008 7:44 am) Toyota has sold THOUSANDS of great hybrids. tell me what GM has done? I don't have to look up the numbers - I can tell by driving down the HWY who's selling hybrids. I see Ford (buying into Toyota's technology) coming up with some decent choices; Honda with the Civic hybrid and Nissan with the Altima. But GM? it's all spin and laughable results up to this point. just to stay on topic here - the Chevy Malibu (a very nice car by the way), is offering a hybrid version that is not likely to catch on. There just isn't enough mpg for anyone to pay much attention.
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Replying to: aspesisteve (Jan 25, 2008 8:14 am) tell me what GM has done?" I am not sure how the total savings of the prius as compared to hundreds of gm hybrid buses in major cities. Only prius drivers care about enviromnent? buses does not count? GM has the two-mode hybrid technology at hand for suv/pickup truck, which consumes MUCH MORE gas than small cars, making small cars more efficient is FAR LESS important than making gas guzzlers more efficient. Toyota does not have anything for big trucks. If you stay in the small car segment, and laugh at what gm has been doing that is not fair, if you look at all segment, you will find gm is far greener than you think. As a matter of fact. read this ... "For model year 2003, DaimlerChrysler had the best domestic passenger car mileage at 29.7 mpg, followed by GM at 28.9 mpg and Ford at 27.9 mpg. The "domestic" imports (foreign manufacturer but domestic production) had superior mileage: 34.4 mpg for Honda, 28.9 for Nissan and 28.1 mpg for Toyota. For imports, the leader was Suburu at 33.0 mpg, followed by Suzuki (32.4), GM (31.9), and Honda and Hyundai (30.4). Turning to the light truck category, Suburu again proved outstanding, at 26.3 mpg. It was followed by Honda (24.7), Hyundai (24.4), Isuzu (22.3) and DaimlerChrysler (22.2). Some manufacturers earned CAFE incentives by selling alternative fuel vehicles" As to 10% saving from malibu hybrid is nothing, 10% price premium is nothing too.
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Replying to: larsb (Jan 25, 2008 5:42 am) |
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