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Consequences of a new Pony Car war - READ ONLY

53 messages,  Last post on Mar 07, 2009 at 12:15 PM

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What is this discussion about? Chevrolet Camaro, Pontiac Firebird, Future Vehicle, Coupe

Messages Page 3 of 6

#14 of 53 Re: v6 a must [socala4] by dieselone

May 18, 2006 (12:56 pm)

Replying to: socala4 (May 18, 2006 9:38 am)
If I'm not mistaken, the split is about 50-50, with many of the retail six-cylinders going to women, and the majority of the retail V8's being sold to men.
 
I know Ford misjudged the demand for the GT and had to scramble to make more available, but I can't believe the mix is 50-50. At least not around here, I see 2-3 v6 models to every GT at a minimum.

#15 of 53 Re: v6 a must [dieselone] by socala4

May 18, 2006 (2:27 pm)

Replying to: dieselone (May 18, 2006 12:56 pm)
You may be right about the mix, particularly when adding in the fleet cars. I recall reading something about this in the past, but I was unable to find it now after a quick search.
 
In any case, I'd say that the six-cylinders need to be turned into bona fide versions, rather than obvious compromises, if they are to achieve high sales numbers and reach a wider audience. Remember that in a broad sense, a sporty coupe could be able to reach a fairly wide audience, and should provide at least indirect competition to a whole host of cars, i.e. Civic Coupe, GTI, Solara, etc.
 
(Yes, I know that these are front-drivers, not American, not direct cousins to the Camaro, etc. but there are buyers who don't necessarily see distinctions between them that are so strong that it would bar them from considering the others, assuming that they meet similar needs. If a Camaro proved to be nicely styled, well built, reliable and otherwise appealing, it should be able to pull sales from several competing nameplates, and not just from Mustang and Challenger buyers.)

#16 of 53 Re: v6 a must [socala4] by dieselone

May 18, 2006 (4:56 pm)

Replying to: socala4 (May 18, 2006 2:27 pm)
Yes, I know that these are front-drivers, not American, not direct cousins to the Camaro, etc. but there are buyers who don't necessarily see distinctions between them that are so strong that it would bar them from considering the others, assuming that they meet similar needs. If a Camaro proved to be nicely styled, well built, reliable and otherwise appealing, it should be able to pull sales from several competing nameplates, and not just from Mustang and Challenger buyers.)
 
And that will be key for the Camaro to survive. A solid handling base model with a respectable powertrain would be a big plus. A 3.9 or better yet 3.6 base model with auto and manual trans would be a very competent car that may win some sales from other areas.
 
The problem is most people who are looking at something like a Civic Si or VW GTI probably wouldn't be caught dead at a Chevy dealership.

#17 of 53 Re: v6 a must [dieselone] by socala4

May 18, 2006 (5:14 pm)

Replying to: dieselone (May 18, 2006 4:56 pm)
The problem is most people who are looking at something like a Civic Si or VW GTI probably wouldn't be caught dead at a Chevy dealership.
 
That is probably true in many cases (although I am confident that sentiments don't run as deeply among typical buyers as they would among us on the Inside Line!) But yes, conquest is important, and no automaker can increase its market share without taking buyers from someone else, so this must be part of the plan. That's why the cars have to be that good -- it take more work to win over converts than it does to sell to your loyal fan base. Unfortunately for GM, its fan base just isn't large enough to help it go the distance.

#18 of 53 New Camaro by grbeck

May 18, 2006 (7:51 pm)

At this point, it's all speculation. GM has not committed to anything with the Camaro as of yet. Given the firm's financial situation, I'll believe that GM is producing a Camaro when I see the official auto show introduction of the production model.
 
And GM, unfortunately, has a history of overestimating demand for specialty models. Has GM even unloaded all of those Chevy SSRs yet?

#19 of 53 Re: New Camaro [grbeck] by carlisimo

May 18, 2006 (8:16 pm)

Replying to: grbeck (May 18, 2006 7:51 pm)
That's true, that the Camaro might not happen at all. But given GM's great love for this sort of thing (niche/halo models) I think it'll get built. I just think that if they weren't so emotional about it, they wouldn't built it to revive the Camaro name but rather to build their brands. Pontiac would be the most logical one. But GM and logic...

#20 of 53 Here's a question for the assembled... by john_324

May 19, 2006 (10:31 am)

Will we see a Asian pony car entry anytime soon?
 
When the pony car wars first started, Japanese companies attempted the make their own (notably the Celica was born for this reason) to compete. However, it just didn't work (probably because of the lack of big engines), and the Asian entries went either 1) down the sport-coupe path to what they are today: relatively small engined, FWD cars or 2) down the sports-car path (the high-end ones).
 
But these days, "Asian V8" is no longer a contradiction.
 
So does anyone think we'll be seeing a RWD Toyota "Kirin" (based say on the Camry platform) with a V8 engine option that'll give the big three a run for their money?

#21 of 53 Re: Here's a question for the assembled... [john_324] by andys120

May 19, 2006 (10:54 am)

Replying to: john_324 (May 19, 2006 10:31 am)
Will we see a Asian pony car entry anytime soon?
  
 
You could argue that the Mazda RX-8 is a Pony car
although it isn't based on a sedan platform.

#22 of 53 Re: Here's a question for the assembled... [john_324] by bumpy

May 19, 2006 (10:55 am)

Replying to: john_324 (May 19, 2006 10:31 am)
Will we see a Asian pony car entry anytime soon?
 
Depends on what counts as a "pony car". Stuff like the nonturbo Supras, 300ZXs, and SC300s of the '90s were the Japanese equivalent of V6 Camaros and Mustangs, and the G35 has no problem hanging with V8 Mustangs (and there is the oft-rumored RWD Tiburon waiting in the wings).
 
Now, if a "pony car" has to have a crunky high-displacement, low output V6 or V8 in a massively-decontented live-axle rattletrap, then no. The V8 is a luxury/high-dollar engine in the rest of the world (even Australia; buying a V8 Holden is like buying a Corvette here) and they are designed for luxury/high-dollar cars. Jamming big cubes into a crapmobile is a uniquely American innovation.

#23 of 53 The field is too crowded.... by andys120

May 19, 2006 (11:00 am)

There was a big market for four-place coupes during the heyday of the Pony car in the late 60s and early 70s but they weren't popular enough to
keep three competing Pony cars in the market place.
 
My bet is that history will repeat itself and rising gas prices, insurance costs and other factors will reduce the demand so that the GM and Chrysler entries will be withdrawn and the Mustang alone will survive.
 
I freely admit to bias on that last point, I owned a Mustang 5-liter convertible for 12 years.

Messages Page 3 of 6

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