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Hatchbacks Honda Fit Buy Now, Or Wait For the 2008 Fit?
95 messages, Last post on Jul 19, 2007 at 5:51 PM
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Replying to: kipk (May 02, 2007 3:23 am) Using http://www.1728.com/convmlge.htm |
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Replying to: kipk (May 02, 2007 3:23 am) My Hi-Lux is currently in my driveway here are the specs direct from the Toyota Philippines website Engine Model 2KD-FTV Type 2.5 Liter Diesel, 4-Cylinder, 16-Valve, DOHC Turbo Displacement 2,494 Maximum Output 102 / 3,600 Maximum Torque 200 / 1,400 ~ 3,400 Transmission Manual Transmission Fuel System Direct Injection Common Rail (D-4D) I agree! The pathetic attempts by GM and VW in automobiles sold here would best be described as failures. I Can't comment on those as I am unfamiliar with them. but Idid have a friend who owned a Mercedes diesel. He liked it but it was problematic. My Hi-Lux gets 24.7 MPG in light to heavy city driving. When I am on rural roads not smooth highways with not much traffic doing 60-70mph I get 15km/l or 35.28 MPG. I also have a lead foot and don't drive for economy plus you have to pass alot of slow vehicles, generally speaking driving here is a nightmare. I will be driving up to Baguio next week and that is a 4 hour drive into the mountains. High elevations and very twisty winding roads. I will fill up and record my mileage for the trip. Lost of steep grades. I think diesel is underrated. Hyundai just put their CRDi diesel into a car smaller than teh Fit but I haven't driven it. That will probably get 50 real time MPG if you don't drive it here. Full size P/Us have had a fair amount of success when heavy loads are the norm. But for the everyday drivers, that I've known or encountered, the slight increase in mileage is off set by higher cost in fuel, higher cost in maintenance, higher buying price and lower selling price. Yes probably true in the US. I can sell my Hi-Lux for close to what i paid for it even in 5 years! I will lose about 20% in a private sale. Since I will be going back to the US in about a year I already have people wanting to put deposits on my truck and it's ot for sale for another year! Diesels are only unappreciated in teh US where big displacement engines are the norm. I really liked my Jazz although I would toss the front seats in favor of Recaros as I have a bad back. Most 4 door trucks do not get 35mpg without even trying. The Fit would very much benefit from a diesel and not a hybrid powertrain. You have to drive disels outside of the US to understand how far diesels have come. It's a damn shame the greenies don't see that diesels with low sulpher fuelare miles better than hybrids. Plus the diesel engine lasts longer than a gas engine. In my area, yesterday , diesel was 10 cents a gallon cheaper than gas. However usually diesel is 10-20 cents higher. Didn't use to be that way! I believe for diesel to be accepted here, it has got to "SHOW" us something that it has not in the past. Yes the US on the corporate level does not want diesels. You can be sure the US will get crap compared to the rest of the world because that's how they sell it to us. They make more money from Gas. Once people can buy a nice diesel car they won't switch back to gas. Hybrids are too complicated and a pain to fix/replace batteries, charging systems etc... How may Prius owners will keep their car for 10 years? I know a lot of diesels here owned by friends who have had them for well over 10 years.
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Replying to: kipk (Jan 14, 2007 4:16 am) However modern gas engines seem to go well over 200K miles if properly maintained. For the average 15K per year driver that is 13+ years. Long enough to get really tired of a car and ready for something newer. Modern diesels will easily get that. My BJ40 Landcruiser has over 180,000km before the odometer broke was driven for 5 years with no odometer and then had a much bigger diesel put in to get more power offroad the former diesel was put into another car and sold. What to see a pic of my old landcruiser? It was a beast! The nature of diesels is that they ave to be built stronger due to the higher pressures. I have a friend in Cebu who is a retired engineer and he has really studied diesels. More than most will ever want to know. He will never buy a gas engined vehicle ever again. I have a few friends with diesel pickups I own one now and i have friends who own diesel cars namely the Hyundai Matrix Yes it's Hyundai as they own that name in the Philippines not Toyota. He averages 15km/l in mostly city driving as there are no highways in cebu. The diesel trucks in the US are great big huge honking diesels designed to pull massive amounts of weight. Like the Silverado 25000HD Duramax diesel etc... Try a 1.5L diesel in a cr weighing as much as the Fit. http://philippines.hyundai-motor.com/ Then look up the specs on the Getz and the Matrix. Yes the Matrix has a weird feeling to the way the engine spools up and then launches you like being in a rocket chair but it is a Hyundai. The Getz is pretty new with the same diesel as the CRDi Matrix but a small econobox. Maintenance on diesels is generally more expensive as many have two oil filters and hold more oil. No idea where you got that from, but it's not true. Here I have to do an oil change every 3 months or 3,000km. last one cost me about P1,200 they also washed the truck and checked everything all over. Most things cost more here than in the US so it's a $25 oil change and filter. I just don't see how that is more than the US which does it in 3 months or 3,000 miles. Drive here for 3,000km and see how filthy your oil is. Not even close to more expensive. The Jazz I owned in Cebu had a more lax oil change routine at 10,000km, but no one waits that long and I use dino oil not synthetic. So $25 oil change every 3 months. Please show me how gas is better and has 2 filters etc... Unless you are talking about heavy duty trucks used for hauling 26,000lbs. GVWR. In hard working vehicles where the engine is under heavy loads most of the time the Diesel is King. But for everyday commuting, lots of idling, soccer mom duties and such, does the diesel really do as well as gas? Does it do better? If so, in what way? No, gas is worse, try driving a diesel everyday and you will never go back to gas. i was always a gas fan, but my dream car is a Turbo diesel Fit with really comfortable seats. I think the fact that the car makers make only huge trucks with diesel says a lot. Diesel is kind of mileage but so much "Green" propaganda that is negative towards diesels is hurting what could be great cars with great economy. Funny how the green people don't research the diesels themselves instead of looking at Old europe with it's high sulphur diesels that are long gone. You have more power, far superior fuel economy and very little maintainance with diesel except in extremely cold climates. |
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Replying to: stevecebu (May 04, 2007 7:02 pm)  Thanks, Kip
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Replying to: kipk (May 06, 2007 3:26 am)
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Replying to: w9cw (May 06, 2007 7:34 am) Plus you breathe in whatever does not get stuck in the exhaust. No one here drives with their windows open if they have A/C. Most of the vehicles in Baguio are some form of diesel as the hills are fairly steep in town and diesel is just better. I only saw a few Honda Jazz but I think if Honda would just release their diesel model it would be a no brainer for me to buy one. The Fit/Jazz is mostly a city car and for fairly decent paved roads. I saw a Jazz get stuck in an open sewer they put concrete blocks with holes to cover them but big trucks over time break the blocks and no one repairs anything here so the Jazz driver didn't see it and most of the wheel was buried in the concrete hole. Just the front passenger side tho. But since he was blocking traffic a few filipinos picked up the car and moved it out of the hole. No apparent damage to the Jazz. Anyway back to diesel. I would hands down buy the Fit if it was offered with a diesel. I really prefer diesel so if a competitor comes out with one even Hyundai I'd probably seriously consider it. Sadly Diesel is in limbo. The Fit/Jazz is a nice small car for the money, my 1.3L cost me P660,000 at that time that would translate to $11,764 of course it's more money now and the exchange rate is horrible!
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Replying to: ssmfitat (Jan 25, 2007 8:34 am) |
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Replying to: stevecebu (May 11, 2007 5:28 am) I'd like to have a diesel in the future, in order to run on biodiesel. Biodiesel (in various percentage blends or even 100%)can be used in existing diesel engines without modification and is becoming increasingly available to the public. I know a few alternative fuel folks who have bought old Mercedes diesels just so they can run biodiesel. Biodiesel is renewable, reduces net carbon emissions, and produces less of other pollutants as well - compared to regular diesel. It can even be refined from used restaurant grease, so you don't even necessarily have to grow a crop for it! We hear a lot about ethanol, but not much about biodiesel. To me, it's one of the better fuel solutions, and I would like to see more good-quality diesel passenger cars produced, to take advantage of the opportunity. |
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Well the Japanese have been making diesels for a long time as have the Koreans. I'm currently in the Philippines and I can buy biodiesel at lots of petrol stations here. It does cost a bit more but all the hype from running off of grease from the restaurants is a lot of hype. Sure it CAN be done but for how many people? In order to really supplant a large percentage of fuel with biodiesel you would need a lot of crops that are excellent sources of creating the fuel. Corn or Soybeans I think are good candidates. But no question that the car companies do not want to sell fuel efficient vehicles to Americans. My Toyota Hi-Lux diesel routinely will get and easy 35 mpg on the highway and we don't really even have highways and even that is mixed driving a bit. I'll wager that not many medium sized 4 door pickups in the US are getting anywhere near that kind of economy. When I move back to the US next year it's a tough choice to make because I did own a 2005 Honda Jazz 1.3L and my truck gets better fuel economy in city and highway driving. Until Americans demand that small diesels be made available the won't make them. Here are the specs on the Hyundai Getz Diesel. http://tinyurl.com/2qtz6b Look up the specs on the car. There is no way that Toyota cannot make the fit into a diesel if they wanted. They already have a diesel Fit in Japan I'm told. If Hyundai brought over the GetZ it would stomp many other small cars. I drove a Hyundai matrix with the exact same CRDi turbo diesel and the Matrix is a lot bigger. It's also on that website. The Getz is a small car like the fit but the power of the diesel makes it feel very fast and the Matrix only gets about 12km/l uhh let me convert that. 28.23 mpg and that is with no highway driving just some rural roads are less crowded than others. In the US on a flat highway cruise set at 70mph you'd be getting a lot better economy than that. These aren't future cars they are here today in the showrooms and in friends driveways. The US has always been opposed to diesel. They sell every Fit they make in the US so why offer us a diesel. But once people start driving diesels which have all the power where your butt can feel it gas cars would decline in sales. VW wasn't my favorite as far as reliability and I should know as I am my family owned quite a few of them over the years. VW diesels are no longer available in the US as of this year anyway. I really want a Fit with a turbo diesel. I have a year to wait and believe me if they make one I'd buy it maybe 2 one for my wife. If it's anything like the diesel in the Hyundai (which needs some work on the power band and the Hyundai's manual shifter is horrible) it would be great! You really have to drive the new diesels to fully appreciate them and diesel here is much cheaper than regular gas by quite a bit. The US is slated to get $80,000 Mercedes diesels that get 25 mpg! Sorry but that's insane it should easily get twice that. Sorry for the rant  I hope Honda makes them but if they bring over the Hyundai diesel and not the Fit I dislike Hyundai reliability but I'd buy the Hyundai as I've driven it and know what the fuel economy is. When fuels hits $4-$5 a gallon Americans are going to be very angry at the car companies from holding back on powerful and very economical diesel engines.
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Replying to: stevecebu (May 14, 2007 7:20 pm)
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