Last post on Nov 09, 2013 at 5:09 AM
You are in the Toyota Camry
What is this discussion about?
Toyota Camry, Sedan
#5400 of 5646 Re: Synthetic oil [Canc]
May 08, 2011 (11:06 am)
I would not expect the use of ANY multigrade oil in these viscosity ranges to void your warranty. There just isn't enough viscosity difference to cause problems. If the dealership told you that Mobil 1 0W-40 would void your warranty; I would ask the regional Toyota Customer Service Center to confirm that IN WRITING. Dealership employees are known to mouth off about things they really don't know, in order to promote their own products; or in order to project an image of confidence and authority.
Here's a description of Mobil 1's 0W-40 in an Amazon listing:
Mobil 1 0W-40 exceeding industry standards and the major leading builder requirements is the cornerstone of the performance reserve that lets Mobil 1 0W-40 keep performing well after conventional oils cannot. Mobil 1 0W-40 provides the widest range of protection -- providing the extreme cold start protection of an 0W grade and the high temperature protection of an SAE 40 grade. Mobil 1 0W-40 meets key industry and car builder specifications for: Mercedes MB 229.5, BMW Longlife 01, Porsche Approval List 2002, VW 502.00/505.00/503.01, GM-LL-A-025 (gasoline), GM-LL-B-025 (diesel), ACEA A3, B3/B4 and API SM/CF. Mobil 1's viscosity is recommended by many European car builders, its wide range providing unsurpassed levels of protection and an overall smooth driving experience. Mobil 1 0W-40 keeps engines starting in Arctic-extreme cold, and it cleans deposits, sludge and varnish often formed in high temperature operating conditions. If you want total engine protection, excellent fuel economy and a product recommended for applications under warranty, you want Mobil 1. The world's leading synthetic motor oil, it features a proprietary SuperSyn anti-wear technology that provides performance beyond conventional motor oils. Technology that allows Mobil 1 to exceed the toughest standards of Japanese, European and U.S. car builders -- and to provide exceptional protection against engine wear, under normal or even the most extreme conditions.
PLEASE NOTE THE LAST SENTENCE. This oil could not exceed the toughest standards of Japanese car builders and also void their warranties!!!!
What is probably going on here is twofold; 1> 0W-40 is not mentioned as a recommended oil in the North American Toyota owner's manuals; because of a POLITICAL ISSUE. But if this oil is not mentioned in owners manuals; that does NOT mean its use will void warranty coverage. This situation came about because, in their well meaning ignorance; the US Congress passed a federal law requiring all new car dealers to only use oils labeled "energy conserving" in every car they service. Energy conserving oil is produced by thinning out the oil so that it creates less friction. The effect of this modification is to improve gas mileage by typically less than 1 mile per gallon. But there is also a substantial downside to this trick; the downside is that it reduces the oil's protection against piston wear and increases the rate of oil consumption.
Shortly after this legislation was introduced, and all new car dealers in the US were forced to use only this type of oil; Mazda RX-8 rotary engines began failing at abnormally low mileages (40,000-70,000 miles) in US service. At the same time; RX-8 rotaries in Canada and Europe were running well beyond 100,000 miles with no problems. The Canadian and European RX-8s were using the manufacturer's recommended 20W-50 oil viscosity; which had now become illegal for dealerships to use in the US.
At this same time; Toyota owners began noticing and complaining of increased piston slap and oil consumption; particularly in Camry V-6s.
As a result of this situation; knowledgable owners stopped having their oil changed by dealerships; and instead began having independent garages change their oil or changing it themselves; so they could continue using Mobil 1 in 0W-40.
#5401 of 5646 Re: Synthetic oil [zaken1]
May 08, 2011 (3:05 pm)
I don't know how to thank you Zaken; I'll check out the availability of 0W-40 here.
#5402 of 5646 Re: Synthetic oil [Canc]
May 09, 2011 (7:44 am)
If I were as concerned about oil cosumption as you seem to be I wouldn't use anything other than "30" weight, 40 if it's available. FE will suffer slightly with a constant viscosity oil, but...
#5403 of 5646 Re: Synthetic oil [Canc]
May 09, 2011 (9:42 am)
It is refreshing to find someone who is open minded enough to recognize sound advice when they see it. Any store that sells Mobil 1 can order 0W-40 from their distributor, if they don't already carry it. You can also buy it directly from a regional Mobil oil distributor in your area. But be sure to not use any other brand or viscosity. The post about Pennzoil european formula 5W-30 in their super synthetic grade sounds encouraging; but that oil would not have the high temperature protection or the low consumption rate of Mobil 1.
#5404 of 5646 Re: Synthetic oil [wwest]
May 09, 2011 (10:05 am)
While I share your perspective on the exaggerated importance that he placed on the rate of oil consumption; old buddy: I'm going to have to disagree with your recommendation of a single grade oil. The reason that single viscosity oils have become essentially obsolete in modern vehicles is that the low temperature lubricating quality of a single grade oil is so inferior to that of multigrades that it actually shortens engine life!!! It is the ability of multigrade oil to flow into tight spaces during the critical first few minutes of engine operation that has been a major factor in enabling the consistently longer engine life which modern engines are now capable of. This is why the use of oils with zero or five weight cold viscosities have suddenly become so popular. Top lubrication engineers have explained that OVER 90% OF ALL ENGINE WEAR TAKES PLACE IN THE FIRST 5 MINUTES OF ENGINE OPERATION. As a corollary to this statement; they have also said that "If an engine could run at normal operating temperature from the moment it started; it would essentially last forever."
Back in the days when I was working on British motorcycles; we always noted how much clattering mechanical noise Triumph 650 Bonneville engines produced. Here in California; the hotshoes always used SAE 50 oil in those motors; because they would blow up under hard driving if thinner oil was used. But one friend rebuilt his Bonneville; and then broke it in on 10W-30. And that motor sounded like a finely polished jewel. The owner then switched it over to SAE 50 when it was fully broken in; and it began clattering and sounding loose, just like all the other Bonnevilles.
#5405 of 5646 Re: Synthetic oil [zaken1]
May 09, 2011 (10:31 am)
But I think you might agree that the higher, single viscosity, 30, or even 40 weight oil would definitely result in lowering the oil consumption.
All else be damned.
But as the engines in my yard equipment, lawn/garden tractor,etc, wear and begin to use/burn more oil my practice is to use a higher fixed weight annual drain and refill.
I have never done that with any car but then I have never had reason to worry about oil consumption.
#5406 of 5646 Re: Synthetic oil [zaken1]
May 09, 2011 (6:15 pm)
Well, a mind is like a book; it works best when it's open.
There's one thing that I still don't get--if this is "normal", then why are so many owners not experiencing this problem? After all, this is a mass produced engine, and so if it's a design issue, then we'd see it across the board, but the fact is that it's not widespread. I know that not all engines are exactly alike, but they're built under pretty tight tolerances these days; wouldn't it mean that mine missed the mark?
#5407 of 5646 Re: Synthetic oil [Canc]
May 09, 2011 (6:42 pm)
Random component tolerances, just must be within specific +/1 range.
Yes, TIGHT individual component tolerances, overall tolerances may end up on theFAR of the bell curve.
I4, number 1 piston is full plus weight tolerance, full minus diameter tolerance. Number 4 is full - weight tolerance, shall I go on?
All the tolerances in your engine, just by pure happenstance, randomness, ended up in the wrong end of overall tolerances insofar as those that dictate oil consumpion.
#5408 of 5646 Re: 2006 camry le brake failure 
May 11, 2011 (8:32 am)
I've had the same problem twice-after they fail it comes back to normal-what did you find out the problem to be-Thanks rcalla
#5409 of 5646 Re: Oil burning update [Canc]
May 16, 2011 (3:28 am)
Hi. Is this oil consumption a problem on particular Camry year models or is this with all of the current generation Camrys? We are planning on buying one soon (maybe today) and would like to know any known issues.
I know that the current generation K engine has some people reporting engine oiconsumptionon as well.