Last post on Dec 01, 2008 at 6:20 AM
You are in the Honda S2000
What is this discussion about?
Honda S2000, Car Leasing, Convertible
#41 of 270 About to pull the trigger
Feb 20, 2007 (2:59 pm)
What monthly payment should I expect with these numbers (lease)? I don't trust my math.
Also, is destination charge included on a lease or just a purchase? the Selling Price includes the destination charge.
Selling Price: $30,500
Money Factor: .0025 (6%)
Residual Value: 52% (based on USAA, I'm finding 57% posted here)
Down: $2000 cash + $1000 from trade-in
Term: 36 Months
Sales Tax: 6.25%
#42 of 270 Re: About to pull the trigger [accelerator]
by Car_man HOST
Mar 07, 2007 (4:01 am)
Hi accelerator. The money factor and residual value that you posted are different than Honda Finance's current program for this car. Its current buy rate lease money factor and residual value for a 36 month lease of a 2007 Honda S2000 with 12,000 miles per year are .00280 and 58%, respectively. Using these numbers, an MSRP of $34,845, and a selling price of $30,500 I estimate that this car's zero down, pre-tax monthly payment should be around $428. I see that you are considering making a $3,000 down payment on this car. I always advise consumers against making down payments on leased vehicles. Those who do risk losing them if their vehicle is totaled in an accident or stolen and never recovered. If you were to make a $3,000 capitalized cost reduction, it would drop the monthly payment for an otherwise identical lease to around $337.
Prices Paid Forum
#43 of 270 Re: About to pull the trigger [Car_man]
Mar 07, 2007 (7:59 am)
My math was good (www.leaseguide.com has a great lease calculator) as that is approx what I came up with, too. After rethinking about the down payment, I would have to say you make a very good point. I think I'll invest the $3000 instead.
I have the lease quote worksheet in front of me but the sales persons hemed and hawed when I started asking questions about the numbers (numbers are below). I started feeling uneasy so I left. I have a spotless trade-in which I owe $18000 and they offered $16,500 (a full $2000 lower than a car in fair condition according to KBB and various other resources I checked).
Residual Adds (W): --
Residual Value %: 55% <-- did they rob me here?
Residual Value ($): $19,167.75
Capitalized Cost: $29,995
Lease Money Factor: .00288
Customer Cash Down: $1943.00
Total Trade (w): $16,500.00
Total Add Caps (w): $774.30 <--- what is that and where did this come from?
Cash Cap Reduction: $1454.96 <--- what is this?
Adjusted Cap Cost: $31,483.03 <--- according to Honda, I had approx $1500 negative equity
Total Sales Tax: $168.69
Base Monthly Rental: $488.04
Security Deposit: $0
Ttl Annual Fes (w): --
ttl Initial Fees (w): --
Amount Due at Start: $1943.00
Ttl Working Cash: $1943.00
One Pay Amount: --
Total Monthly Payment: $488.04
Was I smart to walk away or is this a fair deal, assuming trade-in value truly was fair?
#44 of 270 Re: About to pull the trigger [accelerator]
Mar 09, 2007 (1:10 pm)
Sounds like the dealer was not using Honda Finance for your lease. The residual should be 58% for a 36/36k lease from AHFC. The dealer can't change it, your credit rating can't change it, so it must not be a lease from AHFC.
The rate they quote is also over the AHFC rate, but that could have been dealer mark-up (extra profit) OR due to your credit tier. Most likely is that this is not a AHFC lease.
They are having you put down $1,943 - $488.04 of that is the first payment, the other $1,454.96 is the "cash cap reduction" - to reduce the lease amount/lower the payment. The "total add caps" is probably the lease acquisition fee (I think that is $595 for a AHFC lease), title, tags, "doc fee", etc.
Since this does not appear to be an AHFC lease, then the amounts may vary.
Looks like the dealer picked the lease deal that made THEM the most money and not made YOU the best payment.
If you check over at http://www.leasecompare.com they will do the S for about the same residual and for 0.000258 MF (a tier credit). So if you wanted to use them, you just pick a car and make your deal, then they buy the car from the dealer and lease it to you. I have done that a couple of time with them with nice results.
My S lease is at a MUCH lower, captive AHFC rate. Will they do that again? I would say the odds are yes. We are able to buy these cars for less than invoice price because Honda and the dealers can't sell them. So I took advantage of a really cheap MF on my 05 S lease a couple of years back so I could replace my 01 S with a brand new one "for cheap".
If I were you, I would wait and see what AHFC does for lease specials in the next few months while you work on getting the negative equity out of your current car. Then if they run a special you can get a much, much lower payment and in any case will not have to pay anything down nor roll any negative equity into the new car.
I would get the S somehow, I have sure loved mine
Mar 09, 2007 (2:06 pm)
Thank you thank you thank you. The weather here in North TX is now hovering around 60-75, perfect for convertible weather and I was going to take the plunge. I was surprised that the dealer wasn't willing to work with me much as they have 9 new S's on the lot and 2 used... That seems to me that is a lot of inventory to carry for such a such a small market niche. Anyway, I didn't think of asking about WHO they were using to lease through, I just assumed it was Honda. Explains why they weren't answering my questions clearly.
As for the S, I was estatic to find they were in production for one more year. I'm getting one this year!
#46 of 270 Re: to dwynne [accelerator]
Mar 10, 2007 (12:56 pm)
I would check with other dealers, the S has become a REAL slow seller in recent years and most every dealer should have some on hand. But even if they do and gave you the Honda rate, it will still be a lot more than the "lease specials" they have had in the past (and more than the rate you can get at Leasecompare) - so you might wait another month or two to see if the lease specials come back on it. I would have to go check, but it seems the rate was just under either 1% or 2% at one time - which is really low.
I would not mind trading my 05 for a new 07, since mine does not have stability control. If I could get a deal like I got last time, I would. I got the 05 S for under invoice, they gave me what I wanted for my 01 S, and I did the cheap lease deal. If they bring back the cheap lease deal, I will see if I can talk the dealer into giving me the buyout (or more) on the 05 and swap it for an 07
It was sunny and mid-70's 2 days this week and you know I was in the S, top down driving and lunch (for a LONG lunch) and all the way home. My wife and I went driving after work last night for several hours - we had to run the heat a bit after sundown but kept the top down. Sweet stuff. We both like the S (either of them) better than the C5 'vette convertible I had before - which is saying something.
#47 of 270 Re: to dwynne [dwynne]
Mar 10, 2007 (2:28 pm)
Is the S your daily driver or a "weekend" car? The S would be my daily driver. I occassionally have to go to the grocery store and run small errands... and the little space is my ONLY hesitation. Today it is 84 (and you can feel every degree out there!) and I wonder if I already had the S, would I have had the top up or down. In my current vehicle, the windows were up and the A/C on but then again, this car isn't the S.
If you think about it and you see the lease specials you spoke about, please post something here and I'll continue to monitor this thread... I just really don't want to miss out on a great car or deal.
#48 of 270 Re: to dwynne [accelerator]
Mar 12, 2007 (7:24 am)
The S is the "nice weather car" - I normally only drive it when I can put the top down. Today and Tuesday they are calling for mid-70s and sun so I am in it - though it is too cold (for me) in the mornings to drive IN to work top down
I looked in my Palm Pilot in my "Lease-It!" saved calculations and the lease special from 2 years ago was 0.00082 MF or 1.968%. Quite a bit lower than the current, non-special, offer.
If you just check the special deals on the Honda cars web page they will have the S2000 special posted - if they have one. Currently, there is nothing.
#49 of 270 Re: to dwynne [dwynne]
Mar 12, 2007 (7:39 am)
I'll keep my eyes open, thanks again!