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Hybrid Vehicles Hybrid Vehicles - Archived Discussions Hybrids the Real Payback 
418 messages, Last post on Sep 26, 2008 at 7:53 AM
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Replying to: 1stpik (Jul 16, 2008 1:14 pm)
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Replying to: stevedebi (Jul 16, 2008 3:21 pm) Plus Californians love the HAH because it’s the fastest hybrid under $45k allowed in the carpool lane…
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Replying to: greygabe (Jul 17, 2008 12:01 pm) Those are two ridiculous statements. Do you have detailed proof of the 'long run'? Do you have an indepth analysis of every factor in the lifecycle of any given vehicle or is this just a knee-jerk reaction like so many others in the past. BTW you are entirely wrong about the buying motives of the population at the moment. Obviously you are not directly involved and are repeating old saws from the early months of this decade when they first arrived here. Here's a hint: Gas goes shooting up to over $4 a gallon and suddenly every hybrid in the country is sold out for months. Do you think these buyers suddenly woke up one Saturday morning and altogether said 'Let's go do something good for the environment?' NO! They woke up and said 'Enough!! Let's go get us a vehicle that costs us less to use gas' It's all about the money now. |
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Replying to: greygabe (Jul 17, 2008 12:08 pm) It was not given a carpool lane sticker in CA. It did not meet the 45 MPG combined requirement. Some states allowed all the hybrids in the HOV lanes. |
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Replying to: kdhspyder (Jul 17, 2008 7:31 am) I think it is a question of desire, not capability. As I said, Ford decided not to develop hybrids for heavy vehicles, because it just doesn't provide enough improvement - it was matched by the 6 speed transmission.
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Replying to: stevedebi (Jul 17, 2008 2:38 pm)
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Well here is my contribution. My 2008 Focus PZEV has better emissions than any of the Lexus Hybrids  Mark |
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Replying to: kdhspyder (Jul 17, 2008 3:52 pm) But then OK for a Lexus LS600H extreme hybrid ? I find that strange. For the Ford Escape Hybrid they didn't downsize the engine and made only small gains as I recall. Naturally they would need to supply the 1.5L engine to obtain worthwhile savings. I believe you made a point earlier that the Highlander Hybrid might have been more successful with the 4 cyl. Why do these car companies have so much trouble with 'small' ? How many times do you floor the accelerator and keep it there ? Let me guess - almost never. A back of the envelope calculation shows that a Prius system at full throttle produces 1500lbs of constant drawbar pull up to 20 mph neglecting losses. Of course as speed increases further this will decay exponentially, however system power will continue to ramp towards a maximum of 104 Hp at 51mph and then maintain that level all the way up to top speed. Let's see an automatic do that ! Perhaps they were nervous about towing. Towing capability will need to be limited since this is the one thing that can stress the powertrain. The safest thing that Ford/Toyota might do to avoid inadvertant abuse is to supply a custom towbar hitch so that only their proprietory 600lb trailer could be used. On the otherhand is it a good thing to make these vehicles too economical ? Do we want to see stacks of these vehicles being used for individual personal commuting ? T2 |
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Replying to: toyolla2 (Jul 19, 2008 2:50 pm) This raises questions in my mind concerning the BOF vehciles... Was it decided to emphasize diesel technology? Diesel hybrid technology? Toyota developed the 2-Mode technology then sold it on the QT to GM? That's WAY too far-fetched. GM beat Toyota to market with a workable hybrid system for heavy vehicles so T stepped aside to let the better system prevail? Your last comment is interesting but in view of the San Antonio investment I'd say that IMO they'd like to make the Tundra and Sequoia as fuel efficient as possible. However I do see T often staying just barely in the lead fuel economy-wise or just behind the leaders when I'm sure that they have the know-how and technology to jump significantly ahead. The current Corolla is an example. It 'appears' to be only just ahead of the rest when real world tests show it to be significantly better than the ratings and the rest of the pack. |
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Replying to: kdhspyder (Jul 14, 2008 8:36 am) That sounds pretty high to me. The Toyota RAV4 EV achieved about 4 miles per kWh of electricity. I've got to believe that the Chevy Volt would be at least this efficient. So we're talking about ~10 kWh for 40 miles of gas free driving. $2.80/day would be 28 cents per kWh. I pay 12 cents per kWh where I live.
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