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Hybrid Vehicles Hybrid Vehicles - Archived Discussions Will ethanol E85 catch on in the US? Will we Live Green and Go Yellow? 
2104 messages, Last post on Oct 27, 2006 at 5:34 AM
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Replying to: markcincinnati (Aug 22, 2006 10:15 am) Further, as several studies, including “The Great Alternative Fuel Rally” sponsored by Popular Mechanics have underscored, the number of gallons required to drive an economy car equipped with a gasoline engine from New York to California would be about 90 - 100 gallons. If the average price of gasoline was $3.00 the cost would be about $300.00. To drive the same distance with a similar FFV using E85 would cost about $450.00. The main reason is that E85 "gasoline" will not "go as far" as conventional "gasoline.” Moreover, without subsidies, ethanol is likely to be more expensive than gasoline for some time (years) to come. At this point, the only way to make E85 attractive appears to be to subsidize it with taxpayer’s money. Some taxpayers feel we should not subsidize E85. That is, Ethanol should be viable without spending our tax dollars – period. If it is not, focus on other alternatives, such as clean diesel, until E85 becomes viable economically and environmentally. The quantities of articles (a flashback to "Megatrends") published in our daily newspapers, weekly magazine and the broadcast news features seem thus far to focus on the benefits of being an Ethanol maker or corn for fuel farmer-- and those benefits, apparently, ARE REAL. Yet, many of these benefits will be lost on most consumers when they discover that using E85 carries a hefty cost in miles per gallon. Conversely, the roll out of clean diesel that commenced earlier this year positions us to begin the evolution from gasoline engines to diesel engines (until a superior technology is developed or matures.) Over time, diesel if it attains a 30% market penetration would significantly lower our costs to fuel our vehicles, reduce or eliminate our need for "Middle Eastern" oil and offer a reduction in greenhouse emissions. The question stands, why are the Ethanol articles -- growing in frequency, regularity and depth -- not telling more of the story? Thank you. == The Response: Mark, Thanks for writing -- and reading. I can't answer the question at the end of your letter. Ethanol coverage is spotty at best at most American newspapers. All I can say is that I embarked to examine solely the production side of ethanol and see where, if at all, it fell in Ohio's Third Frontier and economic development programs. I found it ironic that we have all this corn in Ohio, but hadn't joined the bandwagon of ethanol producing states. That's happening now, of course, no thanks to Third Frontier. How everything plays out on the retail and automobile-production side of the equation I don't know. I can't imagine that there will be any shortage of stories on those angles. Senior business writer Cincinnati Enquirer 
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Replying to: snakeweasel (Aug 22, 2006 10:16 am)  Enuff said. (Or by the water treatment facility at the intersection of routes 38 (Roosevelt Road) and 59.) Can you say RIPE!! Or back in the day at the Chi-town stockyards!! 
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Replying to: jae5 (Aug 22, 2006 10:17 am) When I first moved out here about 10 years ago that was one of the least expensive around, times change I guess. The Warrenville station is the closest E85 station that I know of around me, that is convenient There is one several miles to the south on RT 59 and (I believe) 111th that sells E-85, not sure if that would work for you. The only FFVs I've seen are Taurus fleet vehicles. I used to have a Caravan that was FFV, I used E-85 once and my city mileage went from about 21 MPG to about 15 MPG. |
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Replying to: jae5 (Aug 22, 2006 10:20 am) All the times I have been by that intersection I never noticed anything. Now if you want ripe try Hillside at Mannheim Rd and the Ike (Eisenhower Expressway).
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Replying to: snakeweasel (Aug 22, 2006 10:55 am) Ah, yes, another goody!! I think it's all the sweaty armpits from everyone that gets caught in the Hillside Strangler. SW, you're lucky you've never been exposed to the, shall I say, "fragrant aroma" of the 38/59 intersection. Come through there at the wrong time and oh boy!! I should bottle it as a new form of smelling salts. Anyway, the 111th/59 station is a little too south of me, but nice to know. I make all trips as short & sweet and direct as possible, saving as much fuel as I can. |
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| CR has a great article about the ethanol scam this month and how it substantially increases gasoline usage in USA. you won't exactly find the word 'scam' in the article but if it walks like a duck and quacks like a duck, it be a duck. that's what i'm talkin about. mallard style. | |
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Replying to: markcincinnati (Aug 22, 2006 10:18 am) Your series of posts on the subject of fuel ethanol are really excellent--to my mind professional quality. It seems to me that you could collect these and send them to the energy/economics editor of a newspaper or magazine. I suggest sending them to Chemical & Engineering News, an influential publication of the American Chemical Society. Right now the neither US citizenry nor their elected leaders (as the replies from your congressional representative show) are willing to face the hard truths about our fossil fuel consumption. President Bush could only do so in the petulant "...addicted to oil..." crack in his State of the Union speech which insulted our Middle Eastern and Venezuelan oil suppliers. The idea is that to recognize limitations is negative thinking. One of our national myths is that Americans have reached the level of prosperity we have because of our "can do" attitude. We have a habit of getting things done because we don't listen to effete intellectuals who counsel accepting the status quo. Like most useful myths it has an element of truth, but it is being pushed into a refusal to accept real limitations. These real limitations are called "externalities" in the field of economics, a term which to me is revealing of a worldview in which we humans can decide what world we want, except for those pesky "externalities." Seemingly most Americans do not want the matter of our consumption of fossil fuel for transportation really explained because they want a climate of uncertainty so that they can tell themselves that there is some easy fix (like ethanol) which will allow them or somebody to save enough oil so that they themselves can just continue on like they have been.
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hi try [product name deleted for obvious reasons] I was so impressed with this product I became a distributor. Yes and a Prince from Nigeria will give me millions just for helping him get money out of his country. And that I can make $5,000 a month part time from my home. And that by forwarding a simple e-mail Bill gates will send me money. And that Elvis is alive. And that Pluto is still a planet.
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